Toyota 1KZ-TE EGR Valve Removal Blanking Plates

[COILY]

I have laser cut plates available for Toyota 1KZ-TE EGR Valve Removal.
2x plates $50 plus freight.

[kbushnz]

Have yah had any bites?

[COILY]

Not yet. Will put them on TM when i get time.

[axel]

Have they had the mating faces machined? Cheers

[kbushnz]

No disrespect but your price point is too high. I and probably most of us here would just rattled some up with a drill and grinder.. 30 mins work.
But good on yah for enterprise...

[callum007]

$50 isnt dear.. You drive across town to get some 1mm S/S plate, 40 min round trip. Mark out, cut, tidy up, 20 min.

Or send money. arrive in post. 2 min. I know what I'd do...

[sig]

i just used a bit of 4mm mild steel that was lying around for the intake end and then crimped and welded the exhaust end s/s pipe done in 10 mins

[klompy]

If I didn't have access to the gear or the skills I would pay $50.00 for the plates no worries at all.

[wsnownz]

Do you still have these?

[TheonlyReaper]

Hi, i have a '96 Prado 1KZ-TE.
Really want to unleash some of the potential of this beast, obviously want to start with removing the rubbish ie EGR.
I can make some plates prety easy and can put them in no problem, the only thing im worried about is with everything
being computer controlled are there any fault codes that come up in the computer or does doing this say make it use
more fuel?
Any help greatly appreciated, cheers

[zed]

Hi, i have a '96 Prado 1KZ-TE.
Really want to unleash some of the potential of this beast, obviously want to start with removing the rubbish ie EGR.
I can make some plates prety easy and can put them in no problem, the only thing im worried about is with everything
being computer controlled are there any fault codes that come up in the computer or does doing this say make it use
more fuel?
Any help greatly appreciated, cheers

I do egr and pcv to all my vehicles, only the very late model stuff cares (no carbon sensors on the 1kz). The 1kz computer wont fault or raise consumption doing this (you will gain fuel economy actually), its a (comparatively) basic computer with minimal inputs. Doing both egr and pcv mods (and cleaning out intercooler and intake manifolds) gives a very noticeable improvement, and significantly better engine longevity. Carbon from egr is what causes excessive bore wear.

2c

[Gyxx]

Being that the 1KZ is notorious for cooking heads I'd be pretty reluctant to make any modifications that increase peak cylinder temperatures (such as removing the Exhaust Gas Recirculation system) unless I was completely reworking the intake/exhaust and cooling systems.

I know bore wear does increase slightly with the EGR in place but I can't remember ever seeing a 1KZ end up on the scrap heap because of excessive bore wear whereas I've know a great many that have been turned to scrap because the cost of replacing the heads puts them beyond economic repair.

If I ever did see a 1KZ on the scarp heap because the bores were too worn I'd suggest a lack of regular servicing was more to blame than anything else.

[tweake]

Being that the 1KZ is notorious for cooking heads I'd be pretty reluctant to make any modifications that increase peak cylinder temperatures (such as removing the Exhaust Gas Recirculation system) unless I was completely reworking the intake/exhaust and cooling systems.

the catch here is that the highest temps are at full noise and the ecu turns off the egr at full noise anyway. so its getting maximum peak temps regardless of what you do with the egr.

the only thing i don't like with blocking egr is that most leave the intake butterfly setup working. its there to reduce airflow to increase egr flow. without egr going in you have reduced amount of gas in the cylinder and you can get combustion problems due to the lower effective compression.

if you want to reduce egr but not block it off totally, i would disable the intake egr butterfly. that will allow more air flow in and reduce the egr flow.

[zed]

Being that the 1KZ is notorious for cooking heads I'd be pretty reluctant to make any modifications that increase peak cylinder temperatures (such as removing the Exhaust Gas Recirculation system) unless I was completely reworking the intake/exhaust and cooling systems.

I know bore wear does increase slightly with the EGR in place but I can't remember ever seeing a 1KZ end up on the scrap heap because of excessive bore wear whereas I've know a great many that have been turned to scrap because the cost of replacing the heads puts them beyond economic repair.

If I ever did see a 1KZ on the scarp heap because the bores were too worn I'd suggest a lack of regular servicing was more to blame than anything else.

Removing egr and pcv reduces intake temp. Therefore with lower temp (ie more air) and same fuel a diesel runs cooler not hotter. If you look at the egr design on intercooled and non they tends to flood #4 with crud reducing the airflow to the hottest (rear) cylinder and causing premature head failure.

Yota blocks are good castings but do wear with excess carbon. Reducing the carbon ingestion stops bore wear and keeps the hone marks crisp which provides oil retention and therefore optimal lubrication and sealing. In an engine with 19.5:1 comp ratio ring seal and lubrication are important. EDIT: 21.2:1 eeps!

But I'm a fussy engine builder and meticulously weigh componentry and hand polish everything for free crank spin lol.

2c

[zed]

Being that the 1KZ is notorious for cooking heads I'd be pretty reluctant to make any modifications that increase peak cylinder temperatures (such as removing the Exhaust Gas Recirculation system) unless I was completely reworking the intake/exhaust and cooling systems.

the catch here is that the highest temps are at full noise and the ecu turns off the egr at full noise anyway. so its getting maximum peak temps regardless of what you do with the egr.

the only thing i don't like with blocking egr is that most leave the intake butterfly setup working. its there to reduce airflow to increase egr flow. without egr going in you have reduced amount of gas in the cylinder and you can get combustion problems due to the lower effective compression.

if you want to reduce egr but not block it off totally, i would disable the intake egr butterfly. that will allow more air flow in and reduce the egr flow.

x2 - intake butterfly is there to create vacuum so as to get more egr. Turbo secondary pipe sucks pcv and pumps through intercooler. Both a bad idea.

[Gyxx]

Removing egr and pcv reduces intake temp. Therefore with lower temp (ie more air) and same fuel a diesel runs cooler not hotter. If you look at the egr design on intercooled and non they tends to flood #4 with crud reducing the airflow to the hottest (rear) cylinder and causing premature head failure.

This is a trap a lot of people fall into with their thinking because it seems logical that a lower intake temperature would inevitably result in lower cylinder temperature - common sense, right? It's not quite as straight-forward as that though. What has to be remembered is that the recycled exhaust gas has a much higher specific heat than air which means that even though the intake temperature is higher the combustion temperature is lower overall. It seems completely counter-intuitive I know but that's thermodynamics for you.

the catch here is that the highest temps are at full noise and the ecu turns off the egr at full noise anyway. so its getting maximum peak temps regardless of what you do with the egr.

What has to be considered here is the design spec of a diesel engine. Diesel's by nature produce a flatter but narrower power-band than SI engines and that's why they're used in the applications they are. Diesel motorbike anyone? No thanks. Petrol Truck, Locomotive, Fishing Trawler anyone? No thanks. The point being that diesels aren't designed to be operated at full noise and don't work best at full noise. Pesky bloody thermodynamics again - this time in the guise of thermal inertia. If the cylinder temperature is that much lower to begin with it takes a lot longer for the cylinder to rise to the same point than it would if the cylinder temperature where that much hotter to start off with. If you're driving style means that you're at full noise a lot forget the diesels - get a petrol and rev it to your hearts content.

Carbon build up caused by EGR will in time restrict cooling of course but isn't that why we de-carbonise from time to time?

If you're going the whole hog with the intake and exhaust flows, cooling system etc for best power and cooling - yeah sure ditch all the EGR stuff and go for it. But if you're buying an old 1KZ and are thinking it will be less likely to cook a head if you just whip off the EGR and blank it off - it just ain't so...The carbon's already there doing it's damage and all you'll do is cause the engine to run higher cylinder temps and make it that much more likely to fry.

[zed]

Removing egr and pcv reduces intake temp. Therefore with lower temp (ie more air) and same fuel a diesel runs cooler not hotter. If you look at the egr design for intercooled and non they tends to flood #4 with crud reducing the airflow to the hottest (rear) cylinder and causing premature head failure.

This is a trap a lot of people fall into with their thinking because it seems logical that a lower intake temperature would inevitably result in lower cylinder temperature - common sense, right? It's not quite as straight-forward as that though. What has to be remembered is that the recycled exhaust gas has a much higher specific heat than air which means that even though the intake temperature is higher the combustion temperature is lower overall. It seems completely counter-intuitive I know but that's thermodynamics for you.

From my experience working on diesels the EGTs are lower after removing EGR, cleaning and rerouting PCV. EGT is a direct measurement of post combustion temperature. Cooler air in = lower EGT out. That's why intercoolers on diesels are so helpful.

From what I remember about rudimentary thermodynamics, P=V/T or using the same cylinder compression pressure, a higher volume of air will fit in at a lower temperature. More air = less egt in a diesel.

2c

[zed]

if you're buying an old 1KZ and are thinking it will be less likely to cook a head if you just whip off the EGR and blank it off - it just ain't so...The carbon's already there doing it's damage and all you'll do is cause the engine to run higher cylinder temps and make it that much more likely to fry.

If you are buying and old 1kz, block off egr and reroute pcv, clean manifold/intercooler and remove butterfly while its apart you will extend the life of your engine by running it cooler and reducing internal wear by not putting carbon into it.

2c

[tweake]

Removing egr and pcv reduces intake temp. Therefore with lower temp (ie more air) and same fuel a diesel runs cooler not hotter. If you look at the egr design on intercooled and non they tends to flood #4 with crud reducing the airflow to the hottest (rear) cylinder and causing premature head failure.

This is a trap a lot of people fall into with their thinking because it seems logical that a lower intake temperature would inevitably result in lower cylinder temperature - common sense, right? It's not quite as straight-forward as that though. What has to be remembered is that the recycled exhaust gas has a much higher specific heat than air which means that even though the intake temperature is higher the combustion temperature is lower overall. It seems completely counter-intuitive I know but that's thermodynamics for you.

there is a whole host of things to consider but the short version is EGR lowers peak combustion temps. however due to increase of inlet temps (with hot egr system the 1kz has) the average combustion temp (egt) is higher.
cooled egr systems its a little different.

the catch here is that the highest temps are at full noise and the ecu turns off the egr at full noise anyway. so its getting maximum peak temps regardless of what you do with the egr.

What has to be considered here is the design spec of a diesel engine..........

err.......no. thats nothing to do with what i was referring to.

[stu_71]

Is anyone else as completely confused as me now?

[mudsurfv6]

Is anyone else as completely confused as me now?

yeah bro!! lucky I gotta petrol!

[slide]

Removing egr and pcv reduces intake temp. Therefore with lower temp (ie more air) and same fuel a diesel runs cooler not hotter. If you look at the egr design on intercooled and non they tends to flood #4 with crud reducing the airflow to the hottest (rear) cylinder and causing premature head failure.
2c

Surely cooler combustion temp is more productive to lower exhaust temp than just cooler intake air??
EGR gives less oxygen to burn, less 02 = less bang = less heat. (brings up question of economy vs fuel reduction with egr in operation)

Why then is it not always (or even usually) than number four cylinder cracks??

Also PCV on a 1kz? I don't have one now to check but I'm 99% sure it doesn't have one??
Only a crank breather pipe?

PS, Not a pick on author of this quote, it was just the easiest post to quote that included subjects to question

[zed]

Surely cooler combustion temp is more productive to lower exhaust temp than just cooler intake air??
EGR gives less oxygen to burn, less 02 = less bang = less heat. (brings up question of economy vs fuel reduction with egr in operation)

Why then is it not always (or even usually) than number four cylinder cracks??

Also PCV on a 1kz? I don't have one now to check but I'm 99% sure it doesn't have one??
Only a crank breather pipe?

PS, Not a pick on author of this quote, it was just the easiest post to quote that included subjec s to question

Hi Slide, remember that in a diesel, less oxygen to burn = rich = hotter combustion temps and therefore hotter egts. The reason older diesels dont have an intake butterfly is the engine will take as much air as it wants to achieve combustion. Infact the main reason the 1kz has a butterfly is to create manifold vacuum at idle and low throttle in order to suck "enough" exhaust gas through the egt pipe and into the cylinders.

Whilst technically you could lower your combustion temp (whilst not at full throttle) by pumping in mono nitrogen oxides (along with carbon rich particulate, CO & water vapour), the real question is would you really want to? I like my expensive engine, and I would rather cool it's combustion and eg temps down by introducing a higher volume of cooler air for it to burn with the fuel, than force feeding it wear inducing carbon and reducing it's power output. Note that (for the 1kz at least) diesels tend to pocket burn droplets of diesel surrounded by air. This pocket burning is essentially lots of small rich burns happening together, which is what actually produces all the NOx (NO & NO2) & particulate. Wind the mixture more fuel rich and you get lots more NOx and particulate, not to mention heat. Go the other way and put in more air, and you get a leaner, more efficient burn, less NOx and less particulate, and you guessed it, less heat. Personally I prefer the more air/colder intake option, what about you?

Re pcv, I lump all crankcase vent systems under the pcv label. The 1kz runs a cv hose from the rocker cover into the turbo, of which 100% of the cv gasses then go to...the intake manifold. Yay hot oil vapour raising the intake air temperature again.

The point of all this for those playing at home is that egr and pcv raise intake temps and introduce wear inducing materials into your engine. Your engine is better off without them both.

IMHO. YMMV. Just my 2c

[Gyxx]

I thought that might throw the cat amongst the pigeons... OK bear in mind I'm just talking about the EGR, not all the other things that are usually done at the same time the EGR gets removed, and not the long term effects of carbon build up caused by the EGR. I'm just talking about the EGR in isolation.

I don't have time to go into the physics behind it right now (1:30am Chrissy morning) but for the meantime riddle me this if you will: Why the bloody hell did Toyota (and other engine manufacturers) fit the EGR system in the first place given that it reduces power, carbonizes everything, potentially reduces engine longevity, necessitates more frequent servicing, complicates the whole system and is generally a pain in the arse - got the answer to that one? Next question: How did it achieve what it was designed to do? And lastly why didn't they ditch it completely when they went to intercoolers given that by then they were well aware of the 1KZs propensity to cook itself for dinner?

Merry Christmas all...

[zed]

I thought that might throw the cat amongst the pigeons... OK bear in mind I'm just talking about the EGR, not all the other things that are usually done at the same time the EGR gets removed, and not the long term effects of carbon build up caused by the EGR. I'm just talking about the EGR in isolation.

I don't have time to go into the physics behind it right now (1:30am Chrissy morning) but for the meantime riddle me this if you will: Why the bloody hell did Toyota (and other engine manufacturers) fit the EGR system in the first place given that it reduces power, carbonizes everything, potentially reduces engine longevity, necessitates more frequent servicing, complicates the whole system and is generally a pain in the arse - got the answer to that one? Next question: How did it achieve what it was designed to do? And lastly why didn't they ditch it completely when they went to intercoolers given that by then they were well aware of the 1KZs propensity to cook itself for dinner?

Merry Christmas all...

Why is egr fitted? To meet emission standards all the engine manufacturers force their engines to suck their own farts via egr in an effort to reduce NOx out the exhaust. This however produced more particulate due to the less efficient burn, so we then needed the dpf to clean up the crap the egr created (seeing a pattern here yet? ) Dont be on a creeper under a hiace when it goes into dpf burn mode lol

How does egr achieve its purpose? Its SOLE purpose is to reduce emissions, see above.

Why didnt they ditch it? Because it is needed to meet emission standards, that's all...

See below Wikipedia entry for "Exhaust Gas Recirculation". Covers what has been noted above pretty well and isnt just my dumb diesel guy opinion

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exhaust_ ... irculation

So again, ditch the egr, re route the pcv, clean manifold and intercooler, remove butterfly and you will have a better engine all round

2c

[Gyxx]

Yep... Did you read this bit in the Wikipedia article you just linked to:

"Exhaust gas—largely carbon dioxide and water vapor—has a higher specific heat than air, so it still serves to lower peak combustion temperatures. "

If you going to quote something to support an argument it helps if it supports your point of view and not the proposition you're trying to disprove.

[zed]

Yep... Did you read this bit in the Wikipedia article you just linked to:

"Exhaust gas—largely carbon dioxide and water vapor—has a higher specific heat than air, so it still serves to lower peak combustion temperatures. "

If you going to quote something to support an argument it helps if it supports your point of view and not the proposition you're trying to disprove.

Umm? Nobody is disagreeing that when the egr is operation it's single positive side effect is that it can lower combustion temperatures (by choking the engine preventing it from achieving full power). So does putting more/cooler air into your engine, except it does it in a cleaner way. Did you read the full list of negatives for having the egr system? This thread is about getting rid of the egr system because it is a bad system which does nothing beneficial to our engines, hence the op selling the plates.
Less power
Incomplete burn
Produces more particulate
More engine wear
Higher fuel consumption
Contaminates oil faster
Fills manifolds with crud
Shorter engine life

By putting cool air into your intake you lower your combustion temps and egts. By removing egr and pcv etc you are lowering your egts and prolonging engine life, getting better fuel economy, more power etc etc.

Your side effect is heavily outweighed by all the benefits of removing egr. But by all means run it on your own truck, but everyone else here needs the correct information, that your egr should be disconnected because it is killing your engine. Focussing on one irrelevant point against a whole stack of negatives does nothing for anyone. Any good engine builder or tuner would not want his work stained by egr and pcv...They are emmision control devices and serve no worthwhile benefits to the vehicle operator.

2c

[tweake]

"Exhaust gas—largely carbon dioxide and water vapor—has a higher specific heat than air, so it still serves to lower peak combustion temperatures. "

peak temps is the key here. that is not overall temps.

egr replaces a large amount of incoming air. egr basically creates poorer combustion to decrease peak temps and that reduces NOx emissions.
but because your still burning the same amount of fuel (compared to no egr) your still creating the same amount of heat. so while peak temps are reduced overall amount of heat is still the same. the rub is that egr replaces some of the cool air with hot egr which removes some of the internal cooling. same amount of heat plus removing cooling equals hotter exhaust gas, which is what you see on an egt gauge.

more egr you pour in the more soot and other emissions get created. with high egr motors (typically cooled egr) the exhaust needs cleaning so catalytic converters and dpf are fitted.


one downside to removing egr is the engine uses more air. your more reliant on turbo performance and air filters will clog up more.

[zed]

x2 so remove the egr, reroute the pcv, clean manifold and intercoooler, remove butterfly and you've got one efficient, cool running, long lasting wee 1kz

[Gyxx]

Hey guys.

Not trying to bag anyone's skills or experience here. If your doing the mods and getting EGT readings that show you've got an overall temperaure reduction then - like the old saying goes "Once all the bullshit's been stirred and we've all had a nice big slice of crap cake then the proof's in the pudding".

The problem isn't guys who know what they're doing performing the proper mods to remove the emissions gear and get all the benefits associated with that process. The problem is young fella's who get an old Hilux, Prado whatever with a 1KZ and hear "The EGR's rubbish, it robs power and gunks up your engine - junk it!" and then go and do just that; whip it off, fit a blanking plate (don't do any of the other stuff that has to be done at the same time) and then wonder why within the next few months the head goes.