learn me Disco style's

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UBZ
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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby UBZ » Fri Sep 04, 2015 2:41 pm

Disco-Gibbo wrote:Great debating this.
You can modify a Disco a whole lot easier to match a Defender off road than you can modify a Defender to get close to a Disco on-road.


Considering , Both the defender and Disco have essentially exactly the same axles / running gear underneath , One would assume that they would perform the same, with the same modifications , engines aside.
The Defender however has lighter body work and slightly longer wheel base which would work in its advantage on-road ....
LR110 ..... LJ50 project :roll:
Chris.

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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby Disco-Gibbo » Mon Sep 07, 2015 2:39 pm

Sure a little more acceleration on-road, I was thinking more NVH, comfort + safety (which has finally caught up with the Defender).
It's impossible to make any further "adjustments / Mods." to the chassis & body to comply to the western world's pedestrian safety.

Probably a lot to do with the construction? - made up of a series of sub-assemblies ie Bulkhead, rear tub with loose components between all bolted to a chassis.
As it is, it's going to be consigned as low volume manufacture (along with Morgan & Reliant etc.) Whereas, Discos, R-R & typical cars are monocoque construction & a total integral structure welded & glued before fixing to a chassis or sub-frames.

If anything, lighter O/H weight of the Defender would better off-road :?:

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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby 85County » Fri Oct 30, 2015 5:15 pm

the 3.5 v8, best motor ever, will wear cam lobes, thats just an excuse to fitt a hotter cam.

200 TDI Name pom the last of the pommy development ( inhouse) and has it linage all the way back to the 2 & 1/4, i like it better than the 300 tdi, but parts are getting harder and a bit more pricey. but mated to the shitty LT77 is usually the killer for me

300 TDI Name "Brazilian" sort of says where this motor was developed, good i like it, cooling problems in the head and original head gassett meant that you were guaranteed a head job at about 170K, but these would have all been done by now with the newer bits, Vacuum pump is a pain. serpentine idler is a pain. weak water overflow bottle, non crossdriled output gear. is what i view ans things you need to keep an eye on. ABS sensors 150 bucks, more likely they are just out of line

TD5 Name storm. LR product that has nothing to do with BMW, good donk. had out of the box issues, plastic dowels in the head and no lock-tight on the oil pump. but these would have been addressed by now. the ability to get surprising power. a td5 chipped inter-cooled auto with drag off a 4ltr V8 easy while probably inverting the air box at the same time. some had no transfer case linkage, seay to fitt but pricey, some had no transfer case gears, - replace transfer case also not cheep. the 3 amigos ( dash lights), you will need a nanocom, not really a big deal, usually a leaking injector loom. oil has gotten into the plug (110) or into the ECU ( disco)
i will not go into the suspension, though the D2 life there were a number of versions and options. but geometry is not defender or D1 like so less tweekable

V8s 3.9, slipped liners, trumpets coming loose. week spark ( replace with Bosh) needs good quality leads, advance timing to 10deg, get disie recurved. and if you have the bucks drop in GEN 3 injectors. NB if you have an ARB or TJM type of snorkel, have the top facing backwards, then your better for kl per hundred

4ltr and 4.2, they tried to fix the slipped liner problem by not top hatting the liners ??????? didn't work. unless you by cheep these motors, they are not really the donk to spend money on

4.6 THOR ======= GOLD

all toymotor and poootrool driver will tell you that all LR have weak axles, the reality is that the series 2 and 2A had weak axles, series 3 had a weak GB, the series 3 stage 1 is the beginning of the 110, strong ass.

Oh forgot, the puma's === ford
2,4 and 2.2, drive great, good economy around town, 12 ltrs / 100 at 95 klm, 17 ltrs/100 at 110klm. great why they are good but a disposable donk, grantee jobs, extended grantee insurance is the name of the game. LR just swap out donks,

same could be said for d3 and d4

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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby BadCo » Fri Oct 30, 2015 6:05 pm

Are you just going through the Rover section digging up every thread?

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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby 85County » Fri Oct 30, 2015 6:21 pm

yep bored, back to work next week

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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby DieselBoy » Fri Oct 30, 2015 7:03 pm

Opinions and different perspectives are always welcome in this forum :D :D
lax2wlg wrote:Is that like saying 'she's hot, for a crackwhore??

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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby 85County » Fri Oct 30, 2015 7:36 pm

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: i don't think i have Opinions and different perspectives

Hay have you ever seen a shaved Salisbury diff??

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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby BadCo » Fri Oct 30, 2015 7:40 pm

Nope, but it is on my to do list.

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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby lax2wlg » Fri Oct 30, 2015 7:43 pm

Heres an interesting article about it:

Shaving a Dana 60
http://www.4x4wire.com/tech/shaved60/
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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby BadCo » Fri Oct 30, 2015 7:54 pm

lax2wlg wrote:Heres an interesting article about it:

Shaving a Dana 60
http://www.4x4wire.com/tech/shaved60/


Holy crap! That's not a shave, that's a trim!

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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby lax2wlg » Fri Oct 30, 2015 7:58 pm

Suuuuch a big ring gear on those puppies. I can see DB's logic in going back to the standard rear end with Maxidrive axles. About 5 times more ground clearance!
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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby Ralfie » Fri Oct 30, 2015 8:09 pm

85County wrote:200 TDI Name pom the last of the pommy development ( inhouse) and has it linage all the way back to the 2 & 1/4, i like it better than the 300 tdi, but parts are getting harder and a bit more pricey. but mated to the shitty LT77 is usually the killer for me

300 TDI Name "Brazilian" sort of says where this motor was developed, good i like it, cooling problems in the head and original head gassett meant that you were guaranteed a head job at about 170K, but these would have all been done by now with the newer bits, Vacuum pump is a pain. serpentine idler is a pain. weak water overflow bottle, non crossdriled output gear. is what i view ans things you need to keep an eye on. ABS sensors 150 bucks, more likely they are just out of line



Actually both the 200tdi and 300tdi were developed in house by Land Rover.
The 200tdi was developed under the code name of 'Gemini'
The 300tdi was the further development of that engine by Land Rover under the code name "Gemini 3"
When the then new EU3 emissions regulation were introduced the 300tdi could not meet the requirements and Land Rover stopped producing the engine in 1998-9.

LR then sold the tooling and manufacturing licence to International Engines in Brazil, who continued to build the engine for Land Rover.
International Engines also further developed the engine into a 2.8 litre which became known as the Power Stroke.

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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby 85County » Fri Oct 30, 2015 8:27 pm

Ralfie wrote:
85County wrote:200 TDI Name pom the last of the pommy development ( inhouse) and has it linage all the way back to the 2 & 1/4, i like it better than the 300 tdi, but parts are getting harder and a bit more pricey. but mated to the shitty LT77 is usually the killer for me

300 TDI Name "Brazilian" sort of says where this motor was developed, good i like it, cooling problems in the head and original head gassett meant that you were guaranteed a head job at about 170K, but these would have all been done by now with the newer bits, Vacuum pump is a pain. serpentine idler is a pain. weak water overflow bottle, non crossdriled output gear. is what i view ans things you need to keep an eye on. ABS sensors 150 bucks, more likely they are just out of line



Actually both the 200tdi and 300tdi were developed in house by Land Rover.
The 200tdi was developed under the code name of 'Gemini'
The 300tdi was the further development of that engine by Land Rover under the code name "Gemini 3"
When the then new EU3 emissions regulation were introduced the 300tdi could not meet the requirements and Land Rover stopped producing the engine in 1998-9.

LR then sold the tooling and manufacturing licence to International Engines in Brazil, who continued to build the engine for Land Rover.
International Engines also further developed the engine into a 2.8 litre which became known as the Power Stroke.


close., the 300 is a development of the 200, but the development was done by international engines, who also developed the tooling, as well as producing motors for LR, motors were also built in Spain. you are correct about the 2.8, nice donk

Lr was trying to stretch the life of the 200 - 300tdi and knowing of the coming emissions but also not having the resorses to further develop the motor and at the same time develop the TD4, TD5, and TD6 series of motors.

and think about the time delay between starting development and the actual application of the new emissions. also in preparation Lr did develop the 300 tdi ECU edc which was tunable to meet emisions with the addition of an EGR valve and a few other bits and peaces, just in-case the TD4,5,6 didn't work out.

there are no edc 300 tdi in australia. well maybe private imports

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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby Ralfie » Fri Oct 30, 2015 10:17 pm

85County wrote:
Ralfie wrote:
85County wrote:200 TDI Name pom the last of the pommy development ( inhouse) and has it linage all the way back to the 2 & 1/4, i like it better than the 300 tdi, but parts are getting harder and a bit more pricey. but mated to the shitty LT77 is usually the killer for me

300 TDI Name "Brazilian" sort of says where this motor was developed, good i like it, cooling problems in the head and original head gassett meant that you were guaranteed a head job at about 170K, but these would have all been done by now with the newer bits, Vacuum pump is a pain. serpentine idler is a pain. weak water overflow bottle, non crossdriled output gear. is what i view ans things you need to keep an eye on. ABS sensors 150 bucks, more likely they are just out of line



Actually both the 200tdi and 300tdi were developed in house by Land Rover.
The 200tdi was developed under the code name of 'Gemini'
The 300tdi was the further development of that engine by Land Rover under the code name "Gemini 3"
When the then new EU3 emissions regulation were introduced the 300tdi could not meet the requirements and Land Rover stopped producing the engine in 1998-9.

LR then sold the tooling and manufacturing licence to International Engines in Brazil, who continued to build the engine for Land Rover.
International Engines also further developed the engine into a 2.8 litre which became known as the Power Stroke.


close., the 300 is a development of the 200, but the development was done by international engines, who also developed the tooling, as well as producing motors for LR, motors were also built in Spain. you are correct about the 2.8, nice donk

Lr was trying to stretch the life of the 200 - 300tdi and knowing of the coming emissions but also not having the resorses to further develop the motor and at the same time develop the TD4, TD5, and TD6 series of motors.

and think about the time delay between starting development and the actual application of the new emissions. also in preparation Lr did develop the 300 tdi ECU edc which was tunable to meet emisions with the addition of an EGR valve and a few other bits and peaces, just in-case the TD4,5,6 didn't work out.

there are no edc 300 tdi in australia. well maybe private imports



Think you need to check your reference material as you seemed to be miss-informed.

Yes, as I stated the 300tdi (code named Gemini 3) was a development of the 200tdi engine (code named Gemini) but it is a Land Rover in house engine and not Brazilian as you think.
Land Rover sold the licence and rights to the engine only when they stopped the engine in 1998-99 as they were developing the TD range of engines.
Only then did International engines have anything to do with the further development and that was when it became the Power Stroke 2.8.

The EDC engines were not sold new in NZ either. It was Japanese imports that had the electronic injection pump that have found their way into NZ.

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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby lax2wlg » Fri Oct 30, 2015 11:39 pm

I wonder if that 2.8 was developed during Fords ownership, as they trademarked the brand 'power stroke' for their range of 6.7 and 7.3l V8 diesel units in the F250 and up Superduty line of trucks.
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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby 85County » Sat Oct 31, 2015 1:51 am

lax2wlg wrote:I wonder if that 2.8 was developed during Fords ownership, as they trademarked the brand 'power stroke' for their range of 6.7 and 7.3l V8 diesel units in the F250 and up Superduty line of trucks.



Mars is that way >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby 85County » Sat Oct 31, 2015 1:56 am

Think you need to check your reference material as you seemed to be miss-informed.

Yes, as I stated the 300tdi (code named Gemini 3) was a development of the 200tdi engine (code named Gemini) but it is a Land Rover in house engine and not Brazilian as you think.
Land Rover sold the licence and rights to the engine only when they stopped the engine in 1998-99 as they were developing the TD range of engines.
Only then did International engines have anything to do with the further development and that was when it became the Power Stroke 2.8.

The EDC engines were not sold new in NZ either. It was Japanese imports that had the electronic injection pump that have found their way into NZ.[/quote]

ok as i understand it, LR was busy with getting the storm developed so farmed out the 300tdi work to the Brazilians,
there were a couple of instances of industrial action at sohill when this became public knowledge. how ever it was or could be called a LR product since there were a few poms there on the job.


i stand corrected on the EDC, my assumption since every one i know with a disco in NZ have EDC

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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby Ralfie » Sat Oct 31, 2015 2:44 pm

lax2wlg wrote:I wonder if that 2.8 was developed during Fords ownership, as they trademarked the brand 'power stroke' for their range of 6.7 and 7.3l V8 diesel units in the F250 and up Superduty line of trucks.


The power stroke name only came about once sold to International Engines, which at time were producing engines for Fords vehicles (amongst others).
I believe the 2.8 Power Stroke engine was used in Ford Rangers in South America, so possibly why it became Power stroke and Ford then trade marked the name.

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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby 85County » Sat Oct 31, 2015 3:06 pm

power stroke, is a little more than just a name, it indicates the style of injection system.

oil over, CAT style, there was an isuzu 3lt 99ish with the same system

ford got LR in 2000. the 300 tdi was done and dusted by then

the 2.8 is not a power stroke, its good old rotary mech

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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby 85County » Sat Oct 31, 2015 9:23 pm

ops that sounds a bit blunt.

ok the HS 2,8 tgv, some times called the Vixen or td380

the next development id what was branded as a power stroke, if i remember correctly i think only the con-rods were common with the TGV
both that and the following development a 3ltr comonrail were both marketed as " power stroke" this was to bounce off the V8 power stroke brand.

as i posted before, power stroke, was a type of injection system

i found this https://www.google.com.au/search?q=powe ... En9DYgc%3D

and this

https://www.google.com.au/search?q=powe ... En9DYgc%3D

nopw that's power stroke dealt with

Cummings vers Isuzu.

contrary to what some one posted before. GM purchased Cummings and brought into isuzu. GM USA had no access to diesel motors. there last temp was the 5.7 V8 which was a bit of a dog.

the Cummings 6 bd, are very much a copy of the isuzu 6bd. a little more refined but no difference in performance but also open to a wide range of tune.
its the 4 cylinder version wich is in the ADF 110 and 6x6.

so the 4bd1 which started out life as a marine motor in the 60s and dropped by isuzu in the late 90s. 3.9 ltr, the 4bd2 is indirect injection soe we skip over them, the 4BB, same block but a 3.6 ltr, a much smother and better revving motor.
and of course you can slap some rather large turbo s on them. not an uncommon conversion into both latter 110s and rangies. actually a turbo 4 BB at about 18psi, ms gear box would be one of the quickest and nicest rangies i have ever driven

and before i cop flack for be a blow ass and a know it all, i may be in Australia but i came here directly from russia where i worked on a new line (plant) for Volvo ( motors) which was managed by international motors. that was after a few years in china before that Thailand or toy truck land etc

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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby lax2wlg » Sun Nov 01, 2015 4:36 am

Sorry to piss in your Cornflakes, but I think you may need to check your sources, because what you have posted is completely false.

General Motors has never had anything to do with Cummins. Cummins is a standalone company. You are thinking of Chrysler/Dodge, who outsourced Cummins to supply the 6BT in the RAM trucks.

General Motors indeed produced successful diesel engines after the 5.7. The 6.2/6.5 Detroit Diesel engines were produced by GM up until around 2001, and supplied to AM General to use in the HMMWV and civilian Hummer. Despite being a bit underpowered, they have a good reputation for reliability/longevity.

You are thinking of Duramax, which was a joint venture between Isuzu and General Motors to produce a V8 diesel for full size Chevrolet trucks. Again, nothing to do with Cummins whatsoever.

Now regarding injection, in my opinion dismissing any indirect injection diesel is quite narrowminded, because thats basically discounting 90 percent of pre-common rail diesels. Vehicle manufacturers have to deal with NVH and the extra refinement that indirect injection gives at the cost of some efficiency\economy is a measured tradeoff, IMO
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Re: learn me Disco style's

Postby 85County » Sun Nov 01, 2015 9:51 am

ops bugger your correct, got the two company's crossed in my head.

but im not dismissing all indirect disels, just referring to the isuzu bb1 and bb2, same motor different head, in short why bother with a bb2 when there are more bb1's out there

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