Hilux Surf 1KZ-TE Engine Running Temp?

[floatingkiwi]

Hi Mate

Yes you definitely want the temp gauge at the engine outlet, i.e the top hose.

OK, it sounds like you've removed your rad and checked it internally, or at least had a look down. It should be as clean as a whistle - if not change or get a specialist to rod it/acid bath etc.
Water pump? Check.
Thermostat - standard one will be fine.

Auto transmission cooler - biggest problem here (and EXTENSIVE discussion on toyota surf forum) is that the earlier ones like yours indeed had the oil cooler impinging on the area of the bottom hose outlet. The later KZN185 models (99 like mine) had a shorter oil cooler (or maybe a relocated outlet) so that the oil cooler doesn't overlap the outlet. This is the critical factor for overheating in those earlier models.
Again, it's not the fact that the oil cooler is in there, it's the fact that it overlaps the outlet hose and causes a restriction/flow turbulence. So, can a later model rad be made to fit the 130? Dunno. Other options: Manual rad and seperate oil cooler? yes possibly but the oil cooler is also in the rad to HEAT the trans oil to get it to operating temp.

My auto 99 intercooled 185 runs at 76-82 most of the time with rises to 93 ish with very heavy towing uphill and big tyres and ac on, then falls back fast to normal temp. It has a rad with the oil cooler stopping well short of the outlet hose. The only time I've ever seen the needle budge is heavy 4wd with a rad full of mud. I have an Engine Guardian on the outlet of the head.

Matt

[tweake]

Again, it's not the fact that the oil cooler is in there, it's the fact that it overlaps the outlet hose and causes a restriction/flow turbulence.

did you see the discussion where someone checked the temps with the auto left in drive but the surf stopped (ie sitting at the lights for a long time in rush hour). the water temps went way up. heating the water you use to cool the engine is not always a smart idea.

with external trans cooler might be a smart idea to use a bypass thermostat to allow the auto box to warm up.

[bronx89]

Hmm, so would a new radiator like this one be ok? Where the internal oil cooler doesn't run past the water outlet of the radiator?
http://images.trademe.co.nz/photoserver ... 4_full.jpg

Or, is it a better idea to get the oil cooler out of the radiator altogether to help keep engine water temps to a minimum?

Also, what do you mean "left in drive"? Is it better to put into neutral when sitting at lights etc. in an auto? Will that really keep temps down?

[zukmeista]

Again, it's not the fact that the oil cooler is in there, it's the fact that it overlaps the outlet hose and causes a restriction/flow turbulence.

did you see the discussion where someone checked the temps with the auto left in drive but the surf stopped (ie sitting at the lights for a long time in rush hour). the water temps went way up. heating the water you use to cool the engine is not always a smart idea.

with external trans cooler might be a smart idea to use a bypass thermostat to allow the auto box to warm up.

Hence why you plumb in a cooler BEFORE the radiator, then it won't be heating the coolant, and the trans fluid will still be at the right temp.

[bronx89]

How do you plumb in a cooler before the radiator if it has nothing to do with the radiator? Or are you talking about leaving the one in there and plumbing another external one in series before the one in the radiator? Isn't that a waste of time as the radiator water outlet will still be blocked by the internal one?

[zukmeista]

That is probably the best thing you could do to an auto, heat is their worst enemy. Yes, put an aftermarket cooler in before the factory one, that way it will cool the fluid to prevent excess heat in the bottom tank of the radiator, but it won't let the fluid get too cold due to the coolant warming it to the right temp. If you can get a radiator like the one linked above, fit that with a cooler in the way described above, and it'll be sweet as.

[tweake]

Also, what do you mean "left in drive"? Is it better to put into neutral when sitting at lights etc. in an auto? Will that really keep temps down?

putting the auto into neutral when stopped will help with keeping it cool in city driving. won't help when driving up hills etc tho.

, put an aftermarket cooler in before the factory one, that way it will cool the fluid to prevent excess heat in the bottom tank of the radiator, but it won't let the fluid get too cold due to the coolant warming it to the right temp.

any idea what the water temp at radiator outlet is?

[zukmeista]

Dunno, but obviously the manufacturer considers it the right temp for the trans fluid.

[tweake]

Dunno, but obviously the manufacturer considers it the right temp for the trans fluid.

i think there plenty of evidence that manufactures do things more for the cost rather than long term reliability. just because Toyota built it like doesn't mean its good.

[bronx89]

So are you saying you think it would be a better idea leaving the factory radiator and trans cooler in there and simply hooking up another external trans cooler in series BEFORE the factory one?

Or, getting an aftermarket radiator (or manual Hilux one) without a trans cooler and hooking up an external one?

I don't want to get another aftermarket radiator that has a trans cooler in it and hook up another one in series before it - would rather keep the current setup and hook up another trans cooler before it or find a manual radiator and run only an external oil cooler.

[zukmeista]

So are you saying you think it would be a better idea leaving the factory radiator and trans cooler in there and simply hooking up another external trans cooler in series BEFORE the factory one?

Well not if the factory one is the one with the cooler pipe blocking the outlet, I can see why people would want to change that.

[tweake]

the other thing is do you know what condition your existing radiator is like?

if its suspect i would get manual one and external oil cooler. if your in a cold area look at a thermostat for the trans cooler.

[jj1959]

The genuine part number for the 76-90 degree thermostat is 90916-03119.
I've fitted a few to vehicles that do a fair bit of towing.

There are only the 2 options available here, the 76-90 degree and the 82-95 degree (the standard type).

I bought a new 71- 90 from HB Toyota the other day. Now unfortunately my truck runs to cold especially off road and because I have a manual pump there is a lot of raw diesel out the exhaust. Need to re-time pump to compensate. Its ok when the radiator is blocked with mud though

[mudbugga]

I bought a new 71- 90 from HB Toyota the other day. Now unfortunately my truck runs to cold especially off road and because I have a manual pump there is a lot of raw diesel out the exhaust. Need to re-time pump to compensate. Its ok when the radiator is blocked with mud though

Sweet.
Do you still have the part number?
The 76-90 was the only other option, according to our parts computer, available in NZ at the moment. But if you can post the part number for that cooler one, I can chase it up.

[bronx89]

Trying to confirm with the seller whether the internal trans cooler goes past the outlet of the radiator or not, he said that it's "the same" as the standard one but by the look of the pics it isn't the same. If it turns out that it DOESN'T block the outlet and his finger can go right on in there to touch the other side of the radiator will getting this new radiator solve my engine and auto trans temp worries/issues when truck is under load on sand or hills etc? There will be no need for external trans cooler if it isn't blocking the radiator outlet right?

Radiator in question: http://images.trademe.co.nz/photoserver ... 4_full.jpg

Is there anything else I should be asking the seller to know quality? Thickness? Core? Rows? Tanks? I have no idea about radiators

Cheers!

[wsr4x4]

If your factory rad is in good condition then leave it. If you do towing fit an external trans cooler in series with your existing factory one as described above if your not towing dont worry about it. Heres the key PULL APART YOUR VISCOUS FAN HUB AND REFILL WITH EXTRA SILICON FLUID! .you can buy this fluid from BnT . Look it up on the net you will find some write ups on how to do it. So do this first before you start wasting money on shit u dont need I pretty much assure you this will fix it. Also a colder thermostat will not stop over heating at best it will just give you a little extra headroom before it occurs.

[2MEKE]

Radiator in question: http://images.trademe.co.nz/photoserver ... 4_full.jpg

That looks to me like a 185 series radiator. It also appears to have plastic tanks/alloy core. I wouldn't buy it for myself.

I've got a '93 1KZ auto surf that running a manual hilux radiator...brass tanks/triple copper core...cost me $140 2nd hand. The trans fluid is cooled by a Davies Craig 678 cooler...removed the AC fan to fit it. The fan ROARS...if yours doesn't chances are it needs new/more silicon fluid.
I also run an EGT pre turbo and water temp meter with the sender on the head outlet.








Cheers![/quote]

[bronx89]

If your factory rad is in good condition then leave it. If you do towing fit an external trans cooler in series with your existing factory one as described above if your not towing dont worry about it. Heres the key PULL APART YOUR VISCOUS FAN HUB AND REFILL WITH EXTRA SILICON FLUID! .you can buy this fluid from BnT . Look it up on the net you will find some write ups on how to do it. So do this first before you start wasting money on shit u dont need I pretty much assure you this will fix it. Also a colder thermostat will not stop over heating at best it will just give you a little extra headroom before it occurs.

Ok I'll do this today or in the weekend - you reckon it'll really make that much difference when giving it shit on the sand? It kept hitting 100'C reaaaally easily when had it on the beach in the weekend.

Will have a look for some write-ups on pulling it apart and adding fluid this arvo hopefully.

I've got a '93 1KZ auto surf that running a manual hilux radiator...brass tanks/triple copper core...cost me $140 2nd hand. The trans fluid is cooled by a Davies Craig 678 cooler...removed the AC fan to fit it. The fan ROARS...if yours doesn't chances are it needs new/more silicon fluid.
I also run an EGT pre turbo and water temp meter with the sender on the head outlet.

You're right just found out it is for the 95+ models so the 185s. Won't be getting that one.

If adding more fluid to the fan hub really makes that much difference I'll try that. If not, looks like I'll be forking out $400ish for this radiator: http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/car-par ... 214184.htm as I can't find jack 2nd hand at the moment (for a manual one or an aftermarket one) and then more $$ for the trans cooler.

Thanks guys. PS if anyone knows of a manual radiator to suit in NZ or preferably Aucks please let me know thanks.

[zukmeista]

Here is a writeup on fan hub, is for suzukis but toyota should be similar.
http://www.auszookers.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=28644

[bronx89]

Here is a writeup on fan hub, is for suzukis but toyota should be similar.
http://www.auszookers.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=28644

Thanks bud will have a look at it this arvo.

[wsr4x4]

When you think about it end of the day your engine is cooled by air(people seem to overlook this), the water is purely there to transfure the heat from the engine via the radiator into the air, more air passing through rad more cooling.You can have the biggest radiator around but if theres #### all air flowing through it wont do shit! Let us know how you get on.

[kbushnz]

Ok I'll do this today or in the weekend - you reckon it'll really make that much difference when giving it shit on the sand? It kept hitting 100'C reaaaally easily when had it on the beach in the weekend.

Beach / sand work is really hard on the vehicle.
I did an experiment once in my early 4x4 days...
Drove a section of Muriwai at road pressures and watched my gauges... Water temp was running hot.
Then did a run with lower pressures (20psi)
Truck felt better and temps dropped...
Dropping tyre pressures sure helps allows it to float more on top than dig in...
And if in the fluffy stuff drop into low range... takes the load off everything...

[bronx89]

Beach / sand work is really hard on the vehicle.
I did an experiment once in my early 4x4 days...
Drove a section of Muriwai at road pressures and watched my gauges... Water temp was running hot.
Then did a run with lower pressures (20psi)
Truck felt better and temps dropped...
Dropping tyre pressures sure helps allows it to float more on top than dig in...
And if in the fluffy stuff drop into low range... takes the load off everything...

Ah ok didn't realise dropping from road pressure would make that much difference on temps but now that I think about it of course having it float more = less work = lower temps!

Also didn't realise dropping into low range would help temps and take the load off everything, I would have thought it'd put more load and increase temps because it seems like it's working so much harder!

Thanks


EDIT: Heard back from Toyota, they want $50+ GST for a bottle of fan clutch silicon fluid/oil. SHIT! Got told the stuff was $8-10!

[Henry]

Hi

try pricing a new Viscous Clutch.

The bottle is really REALLY cheap............

[klompy]

BNT is cheaper about $20.00 couple of months ago.

[bronx89]

Hi

try pricing a new Viscous Clutch.

The bottle is really REALLY cheap............

$260+ GST for the new fan clutch. Bottle really REALLY cheap? $50 ain't cheap for a small bottle of silicon fluid to me!

BNT is cheaper about $20.00 couple of months ago.

Yea was trying to think of other places that would sell the silicon fluid for the fan clutch - will try BNT and a few other places if I finish early today, thanks.

[bronx89]

Right, took the fan clutch out and apart and this is what I found:



Does this look right/wrong with regards to the oil/fluid level? How are you supposed to tell how much is in there? And when filling, do you fill the top/front or bottom/back and up to what level? BNT were the cheapest I could find, $26+GST.

If anyone who knows about this stuff could reply before the end of the day th at'd be great so I can fill it (if needed) today for the beach tomorrow. Thanks!

[kbushnz]

Have a read thru this and its links.
http://neuralfibre.com/paul/4wd/tuning- ... fan-clutch

I have done mine, easy enough...

[bronx89]

Have a read thru this and its links.
http://neuralfibre.com/paul/4wd/tuning- ... fan-clutch

I have done mine, easy enough...

Did you fill the front up to a couple of mm from hitting the top and overflowing?

Just did mine - looked like it had virtually no fluid in there! It took about 40ml from what I can tell to get it up to about 3mm from overflowing.

True test will be tomorrow on Muriwai beach if it will run cooler or not - fingers crossed. Will post up how I get on, thanks.

[crazyclark31]

just something else to think about. Is your auto trans ok? As if it is on the way out it will heat the trans oil up which in turn will heat your water in the radiator up.Don't know how many guys i've talked to that complain their truck heats up at the beach. Just about all the time its because they have left it in drive and labour the trans
IMHO you should just do away with the trans oil flowing through the rad and run it soley through an external cooler. Esp if you drive in sand or load the trans up.That how i have my safari set up and have never had heating probs with either the motor or trans