Death Wobble

[Want2Retire]

Wondering if there is a methodical process to try and pin point what is causing death wobble on a 1995 XJ Cherokee?

It kicks in at about 110km/h and I was hoping there may be a list of culprits that can be checked?

Cheers

[pmfg]

Wheel alignment.
ballanced wheels.
Steeing damper.

Those are the three places id start.

[Want2Retire]

Thanks for that pmfg will check these.

I did try google for an answer to the DW but found so many conflicting suggestions that it seemed like the only response was to replace everything in the front suspension and steering.

[lax2wlg]

Very common cause: Worn track bar (panhard)

[Want2Retire]

Is it best to try replacing the bushes on track bar or replace whole bar?

Thanks, appreciate any advice.

[lax2wlg]

Is it lifted?

[Ant]

FYI: my mrs did my panhard and fixed it on my Safari.

[rokhound]

Panhard bushes. Although all the other issues need to correct as well. If you want to do the whole process of elimination thing, then start with a wheel balance, wheel alignment, tie rod and drag link ball joints, control arm bushes, and then Panhard. Then get the wheel alignment done again.

Me, I'd just start with the Panhard bushes first.

[yeti]

track bar ....think one outta a v8 grand is a good upgrade ....read on a yank jeep forum...will find link

[Jay]

Had the same thing on a 1998 Grand Cherokee - kicked in at around 95 - 100kms and was uncontrollable when it did!.... New Panhard/track bar rod bushes sorted it. Other things to check :

Tie rod ends
Wheel Bearings and swivel hub bearings (Even if they 'feel' okay checking movement at the wheel, they are often poked and will cause death wobble)
Out of round tyre / bent rim
Incorrect castor angles
Knackered shocks

As others have suggested, wheel balancing/alignment, steering dampner (although these generally aren't the issue, but help to mask it).

Death wobbles are a pain in the a** - and sometimes a combination of the above! I'd start with the panhard rod bushes and go from there.

Good luck.

Jay

[keithal]

Wondering if there is a methodical process to try and pin point what is causing death wobble on a 1995 XJ Cherokee?

It kicks in at about 110km/h and I was hoping there may be a list of culprits that can be checked?

Cheers

if it doesnt kick in until 110km/h it means your speeding

you meant it kicks in at 90 km/h didnt ya

[Want2Retire]

Um yeah, sorry meant 90km/h...

Thanks everyone for the advice really appreciate it.

[mud_slinger]

if it was wheel balancing you would feel it round 80km. start with pan hard as others have said

[Jeeper]

Would I be right in saying its actually the bolt hole for the panhard becoming slightly elliptical ? So regardless of bush replacement the issue remains unless you drill out and replace the bolt with a larger diameter one...or something to that effect...

[Want2Retire]

lax2wlg, no not lifted...yet

[slide]

Wheel balance IMO will never cause death wobble. It can cause a very bad (even extreme) wobble, but is always constant. Either it shakes, or it doesn't. (it can come and go with speed variances, but generally is worst at highway speeds).
Death wobble is unpredictable. The vehicle can sometimes have not much wobble, then can quickly and violently start to vibrate. Often this can be caused by a slight uneven road, eg slight bump. Vision gets blurred, steering wheel shakes so bad there's no way of stopping the wobble (you just hang on and try keep it straight), and if you keep trying to drive through it your jaw hurts in a similar manner to when you laugh too much; only this time its from your head being shaken so much. (and this is a scary phenomenon- especially with a vehicle in other lane approaching..)

When did wobble start? ie was it sudden change, or has it slowly developed worse?

Either way, my recommendations,
firstly- tyres - make sure pressure are all up to spec, and that they are adequate wall strength (ie load ratings)
second, steering joints - get someone to shake steering wheel with engine idling, check all tierod ends and suspension bushes- pay close attention to panhard bushes (as mentioned above, these are a prime candidate)
If you are not sure about anything, either replace or get someone else to check it with you.

Nath

[luckyme]

I'd start with this

http://www.ironrockoffroad.com/Merchant2/Steering%20Shimmy%20elimination%20checklist.pdf

or this

http://www.kevinsoffroad.com/how-to-fix-your-own-death-wobble/

[lax2wlg]

Would I be right in saying its actually the bolt hole for the panhard becoming slightly elliptical ?

Good call, If it was lifted, I would say quite possibly. When lifted it creates a pulling effect on the whole axle assembly, inevitably f**ng the single bolt hole that holds it in.

[pmfg]

Would I be right in saying its actually the bolt hole for the panhard becoming slightly elliptical ?

Good call, If it was lifted, I would say quite possibly. When lifted it creates a pulling effect on the whole axle assembly, inevitably f**ng the single bolt hole that holds it in.

How do you fix an oval hole? The brackets welded directly to the chassis.
You have to cut it off and weld a new one on?

[yeti]

that's what I had to do to the tj ,,,,,its in the build somewhere..

[lax2wlg]

How do you fix an oval hole? The brackets welded directly to the chassis.
You have to cut it off and weld a new one on?

What chassis?!
You drill a new hole and relocate the panhard mount over to where it should be after lifting it, so the axle sits in the middle.

Otherwise adjustable panhard to prevent this

[WRNGLR]

How do you fix an oval hole? The brackets welded directly to the chassis.
You have to cut it off and weld a new one on?

Weld a big washer with same size hole as original to the bracket on either side works well

[pmfg]

Weld a big washer with same size hole as original to the bracket on either side works well

Ohh yeah thats not a bad idea.

[bob_or_jim]

I have had the dreaded death wobble on my surf and it can be triggered by a small bump or even undulations while braking.

Anyway I have found I have had too much toe in. I wound it out 1 turn and it seems to have made it alot better. It still seems as though I have an issue with the loose steering box but will get that sorted.

Long story short check your alignment esp toe in.

[Want2Retire]

Cheers bob_or_jim. Appreciate the advice. Would it be worth getting a wheel alignment now, or wait for a month or so when I get my new set of tyres, or are alignments irrelevant of tyres?

[waza4x4toy]

Hi cant disagree with any of the points listed here

Info i can add is

while googling other front diff stuff on USA forums for my XJ last night read several posts saying main hub Ball joint wear causes the "jeep death wobble"

I just happened to pull my track bar out last week and found the bolt had significant shaft wearing so was not tight and allowed some slop but not enough to cause wobble though

I went on to highway after being in thick mud one day which had caught in the usual place on jeep rims but had sunk to bottom got up to speed and could not hold the wheel it was so bad, scared the hell out of me , stopped and cleared mud out of inter rim curve and solved issue so wheel balance can effect his also!

[bob_or_jim]

You can check this with a tape measure easy enough. measure the width of ya track at the front of your front tires and then measure at the rear of the front tires. Anything over a couple of mm
(3-4?) would be too much I'd say.