Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

vvega
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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby vvega » Tue Apr 28, 2009 4:18 pm

KiwiBacon wrote:
vvega wrote:kiwi you lost .. get over it
take a look at any of the "cheerleaders" trips were mudzilla is driving his truck and you will see lpg fume in action and working without det
there is no mob mentality there just a idiot who was proven wrong and cant get past it

you did it wrong get over it


This is the guy who thinks an idling 3.9 litre diesel engine consumes 6 litres of air per minute.
Later revised his estimate to 60 litres a minute and still doesn't know what the debate was.

His sidekick claims to have a landcruiser with over 900Nm of torque, which turned into 900Nm of talk which couldn't be backed up.

It's pretty hard to have an intelligent debate in such company.

comming from the guy that dosent know what a flashpoint or a boiling point is that mildly amusing
nothing you have said has been backed up with anything other than you sticking a pipe up a intake and turning the tap on
yet we gave you articals and documents .. systems for sale with warranty's
video's of a truck running in full load conditions on fume
and yet you still come back to your flawed test in which you failed miserably to accuratly measure the flow and frankly with your willingness to lie i don't doubt the results are completely false as well

here are some vids including muzilla
you have one vid
we have about 20 of it working
Jafa wrote:Heres some vids fom Thompsons track, Mudzilla in his 1kzte Hilux, Ben in the tree fiddy fordie and my Jalopy































More coming soon!

game over buddy
time to move on and get some better work stoys

your right it is hard to have a intelligent debate in such company
mostly because you cant face the facts
how can you do a test and report results when you dont even understand the words your using its rediculious

the fact your still trying to propagate this rubbish is frankly quite disgraceful and reflects poorly on the rest of us

flyingbrick wrote:
KiwiBacon wrote:
You claim to tune cars (and be good at it) yet you don't even know how much air an engine ingests.

I'm off to do some work, I'll be back much later on.



I've seen a few of waynes vehicles over the years and a few of his tunes.... Its pretty safe to say he knows what he is doing :lol: ....regardless of how much air is ingested into whatever engine.
I have seen him achieve in one or two weekends what takes some people months (1uz into his previous truck jumps to mind.. this included custom bellhousing/engine mounts/etc etc etc and was very impressive from many aspects) and i have ridden in atleast 3 vehicles in 2 years which were built/tuned by wayne and which were quite fast (his current truck is stupidly fast and his 400hp Aw11 was just rediculious)
Its actually a shame you do not know more about him- you'd feel quite stupid having made the comments that you have.

I personally have a whole lot more respect for people who go out and do stuff and more importantly people who go out and do stuff and who are successful (like all the people here who have been using lpg for long periods of time).

With regards to you getting back to work.............Sounds like you must be flat out- what with all the time you are able to spend on the WWW.

Perhaps you could submit your life to that NZpolice add on tv.. i can see it now.

you walk in the front door
Hunnnyyyyy. im hooome.


your bf walks up and gives you a hug
aw baby how was your day at work?


you get all starey eyed..(mostly because you are hugging a bloke)
oh it was pretty quiet I WAS ON THE INTERNET MOST OF THE DAY TRYING TO PROVE TO ALL OF OFF-ROAD-EXPRESS THAT LPG INJECTION IS BAD AND THAT IM NOT A TOTAL F-WIT


and then your bf is like
:|

and its like

get some better work stories.
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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby wopass » Tue Apr 28, 2009 4:35 pm

ohh Vvega enough :lol: and you to bacon, go back to the fume thread and talk about it there, this thread has been over run enough :lol:

ohh and i do enjoy driving 900nm+ of talk ...and i could back it up, but makes my tounge tired :lol: :lol:

enough me!!! :roll:
If you already know everything, DON'T ask bloody questions!!

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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby DieselBoy » Tue Apr 28, 2009 4:57 pm

Don't make me post "THE" Photo's :lol: :lol:
lax2wlg wrote:Is that like saying 'she's hot, for a crackwhore??

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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby mudzilla » Tue Apr 28, 2009 5:03 pm

DieselBoy wrote:Don't make me post "THE" Photo's :lol: :lol:


PLEASE :lol: :lol: But in the Fuming thread :evil:
36" Simex's is as close as I get to gardening

01' GMC Duramax 6.6 Turbo V8 Diesel ,,, 95' HiLux Winch truck ..

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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby KiwiBacon » Tue Apr 28, 2009 5:32 pm

vvega wrote:comming from the guy that dosent know what a flashpoint or a boiling point is that mildly amusing
nothing you have said has been backed up with anything other than you sticking a pipe up a intake and turning the tap on
yet we gave you articals and documents .. systems for sale with warranty's
video's of a truck running in full load conditions on fume
and yet you still come back to your flawed test in which you failed miserably to accuratly measure the flow and frankly with your willingness to lie i don't doubt the results are completely false as well


Look up flash point and boiling point for lpg. They both happen in the bottle. Unless you're injecting liquid (which none of these systems are) it's irrelevant.

Flashpoint -104C
Boiling point -42C
Source:
http://www.iigas.com/propane_msds.htm

Is there going to be any tech from you at all?

vvega wrote:here are some vids including muzilla
you have one vid
we have about 20 of it working
game over buddy
time to move on and get some better work stoys


Nice videos but how are they relevant and how do they prove that it lpg isn't detonating?
How do you explain the detonation in my video?

You've repeated over and over again that lpg can't burn below the LFL, but can't understand that the flammability limits involve external ignition, not internal heat.[/quote]

What does your homophobia have to do with lpg in diesels?

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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby mudzilla » Tue Apr 28, 2009 5:49 pm

KiwiBacon wrote:
vvega wrote:How do you explain the detonation in my video?


WHAT PART OF....TO MUCH LPG DO YOU NOT FECKING UNDERSTAND DICKHEAD
36" Simex's is as close as I get to gardening

01' GMC Duramax 6.6 Turbo V8 Diesel ,,, 95' HiLux Winch truck ..

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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby vvega » Tue Apr 28, 2009 5:50 pm

KiwiBacon wrote:
vvega wrote:comming from the guy that dosent know what a flashpoint or a boiling point is that mildly amusing
nothing you have said has been backed up with anything other than you sticking a pipe up a intake and turning the tap on
yet we gave you articals and documents .. systems for sale with warranty's
video's of a truck running in full load conditions on fume
and yet you still come back to your flawed test in which you failed miserably to accuratly measure the flow and frankly with your willingness to lie i don't doubt the results are completely false as well


Look up flash point and boiling point for lpg. They both happen in the bottle. Unless you're injecting liquid (which none of these systems are) it's irrelevant.

Flashpoint -104C
Boiling point -42C
Source:
http://www.iigas.com/propane_msds.htm

Is there going to be any tech from you at all?

vvega wrote:here are some vids including muzilla
you have one vid
we have about 20 of it working
game over buddy
time to move on and get some better work stoys

KiwiBacon wrote:
Nice videos but how are they relevant and how do they prove that it lpg isn't detonating?
How do you explain the detonation in my video?

you have very audable det in your vid yet you cant hear any in his
even when standing next to the truck.. you cant hear it

explaining yours.. we've done this a million times and you still cant get it
you did it wrong .. just like you got your measurements wrong ... just like you don't understand the technical words
you don't have the knowledge or the ability to fume its that simple
why is that so hard for you to understand
KiwiBacon wrote:You've repeated over and over again that lpg can't burn below the LFL, but can't understand that the flammability limits involve external ignition, not internal heat.

lol nope you still don't know how it works what it means or even what your tring to say and your uneducable so what's the point trying
funny how you have gone from not having a simple understanding of even the words involved let alone the theory and yet now your a expert ??
and even now you still don't ...... what's the point in trying
when will the hilarity stop
KiwiBacon wrote:What does your homophobia have to do with lpg in diesels?
[/quote]
again you cant read context understand simple paraphrases or even grasp what a quotation is.. i just quoted a post ... because it was so dam funny , its got nothing to do with my personal view on your sexuality or my feeling towards homosexuals
what it does show yet again is your ability to twist and contort facts until you think they mean what you want them too
its pretty evident throughout this entire thread and just about every their thread you've posted that this is the case
its not hard to see why you just dont get it

at the end of the day you have entire weekends dedicated to what a fool you are and how you continually try to bullshit and belittle people
and yet you still dont realise

i can see why you dont get fuming .. or anything really
you cant get past your own ego to see what is actually real and not just what you believe

you simply are not going to convince 20 odd people that have seen fuming working with there own eyes ... that what you say has any validity or vindication

next you'll be trying to tell us the sky is red

give it up
Last edited by vvega on Tue Apr 28, 2009 5:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby wopass » Tue Apr 28, 2009 5:54 pm

OI YOU TARDS!!!

GO TO THE FUME THREAD AND STOP WRECKING THIS ONE!!!
If you already know everything, DON'T ask bloody questions!!

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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby KiwiBacon » Tue Apr 28, 2009 6:00 pm

mudzilla wrote:
KiwiBacon wrote:
vvega wrote:How do you explain the detonation in my video?


WHAT PART OF....TO MUCH LPG DO YOU NOT FECKING UNDERSTAND DICKHEAD


How is 0.4% of the incoming air too much lpg?

It is below the point where Vvega says it can't happen.

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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby vvega » Tue Apr 28, 2009 6:02 pm

perhaps if you go to the thread named fuming and read it you might get a idea on where you went wrong
its was a fairly fundamental mistake
http://www.offroadexpress.co.nz/Forums/ ... &start=315

her hear is alink .. do you think you can follow that or will you #### that up as well
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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby mudzilla » Tue Apr 28, 2009 6:04 pm

Your still not listening... How have YOU ever learned anything in you life without listening or were you born a fuckn genius...????

A COUPLE OF PERCENT OF THE FUEL VOLUME.. Did you hear me yet !!!
36" Simex's is as close as I get to gardening

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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby KiwiBacon » Tue Apr 28, 2009 6:08 pm

vvega wrote:you have very audable det in your vid yet you cant hear any in his
even when standing next to the truck.. you cant hear it


What is his fumigation rate?

vvega wrote:explaining yours.. we've done this a million times and you still cant get it
you did it wrong .. just like you got your measurements wrong ... just like you don't understand the technical words
you don't have the knowledge or the ability to fume its that simple
why is that so hard for you to understand


If my measurements were out by a factor of 5, it would still be under the LFL.
There is no way my measurements are out by a factor of 5 or even 2.

vvega wrote:lol nope you still don't know how it works what it means or even what your tring to say and your uneducable so what's the point trying
funny how you have gone from not having a simple understanding of even the words involved let alone the theory and yet now your a expert ??
and even now you still don't ...... what's the point in trying
when will the hilarity stop


More abuse with no point.


vvega wrote:again you cant read context understand simple paraphrases or even grasp what a quotation is.. i just quoted a post ... because it was so dam funny , its got nothing to do with my personal view on your sexuality or my feeling towards homosexuals
what it does show yet again is your ability to twist and contort facts until you think they mean what you want them too
its pretty evident throughout this entire thread and just about every their thread you've posted that this is the case
its not hard to see why you just dont get it


So you quote a post calling me gay and that means I don't get it?
That's just more abuse with no point.

vvega wrote:at the end of the day you have entire weekends dedicated to what a fool you are and how you continually try to bullshit and belittle people
and yet you still dont realise

i can see why you dont get fuming .. or anything really
you cant get past your own ego to see what is actually real and not just what you believe

you simply are not going to convince 20 odd people that have seen fuming working with there own eyes ... that what you say has any validity or vindication

next you'll be trying to tell us the sky is red

give it up


More abuse with no point.
Pretty funny that you guys waste weekends talking about me though.

P.S. The sky often is red.
Red in the morning shephards warning etc.

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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby KiwiBacon » Tue Apr 28, 2009 6:12 pm

mudzilla wrote:Your still not listening... How have YOU ever learned anything in you life without listening or were you born a fuckn genius...????

A COUPLE OF PERCENT OF THE FUEL VOLUME.. Did you hear me yet !!!


Wow, more abuse.

There is not a single fumigation system on this planet that adds lpg based on fuel volume. They all work on air volume.

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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby vvega » Tue Apr 28, 2009 6:12 pm

vvega wrote:perhaps if you go to the thread named fuming and read it you might get a idea on where you went wrong
its was a fairly fundamental mistake
http://www.offroadexpress.co.nz/Forums/ ... &start=315

her hear is alink .. do you think you can follow that or will you #### that up as well



yeap evidently you did #### that up totally
pretty easy to see why you dont get it
you couldn't even understand to go to the other threed
why on earth would you understand fume
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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby vvega » Tue Apr 28, 2009 6:13 pm

KiwiBacon wrote:
mudzilla wrote:Your still not listening... How have YOU ever learned anything in you life without listening or were you born a fuckn genius...????

A COUPLE OF PERCENT OF THE FUEL VOLUME.. Did you hear me yet !!!


Wow, more abuse.

There is not a single fumigation system on this planet that adds lpg based on fuel volume. They all work on air volume.

nope thats just you been a egg
mudzilla's is based of fuel consumption .. in order for it to ba based on air consumption you woudl need a maf of some description .. yet his is hooked to his TPS ... so its load based so its supplyed at a % of the fuel rate
and that is what weve been saying for such a looong time now
and is exactly why you cant get fume to work and why this is so amusing

so fundimental
and such a massive fuckup on your part
they all work on a LOAD based system load has nothing to do with air consumption

well except for yours .. yours is based on a massive ego and a lack of understanding
Last edited by vvega on Tue Apr 28, 2009 6:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby KiwiBacon » Tue Apr 28, 2009 6:28 pm

vvega wrote:nope thats just you been a egg


Oh look, more abuse.
vvega wrote:mudzilla's is based of fuel consumption .. in order for it to ba based on air consumption you woudl need a maf of some description .. yet his is hooked to his TPS ... so its load based so its supplyed at a % of the fuel rate
and that is what weve been saying for such a looong time now
and is exactly why you cant get fume to work and why this is so amusing

so fundimental
and such a massive fuckup on your part


His use is based on average fuel consumption, which gives you absolutely no clues for what the peak rate of fumigation is.

TPS on a diesel has very little to do with injected fuel volumes as the engine is governed the entire time. I thought you'd know that.

The only influence TPS has on most of them is as an on/off switch. Turns it off when your foot is lifted.

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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby vvega » Tue Apr 28, 2009 6:31 pm

do you not understand what a load based fuel system is ?
the tps tells you how far your foot is down .. so therefore how much load your engine is under
and based on this the fuel is delivered

you talk of compensator's governors etc but im trying to keep this simple for you
thats why the decent fume kits have ecu control ... to offset and control the finer points of delivery

this was all in that very first artical i linked in the fume thread ... again you didn't read it so you cont understand
its said in black and white that air volume has NOTHING to do with fumigation rates
again you dont understand what you are talking about so how can you expect to get it right
just like boiling points and flash points , you just dont understand and you are doing it wrong
is any of this sinking through ?
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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby vvega » Tue Apr 28, 2009 6:43 pm

High-pressure liquid petroleum gas (LPG) is converted to a low-pressure (just above atmospheric) useable gas. The gas passes through a solenoid valve (or stepper motor) which is controlled by outputs from the system’s computerised processor measuring precisely the quantity of gas required. This metered amount of vapour travels through a hose into the vehicle air intake system and subsequently into the inlet manifold as a mixture of air and gas.

The computer module (processor) controls the flow of gas optimising performance and ensuring safety. Manifold pressure (via a MAP sensor) or throttle position (via a throttle position sensor) and engine speed are monitored. The module then adjusts the gas flow depending on engine load and driver demand. The amount of gas injected (or the ‘gas map’) is completely (and only) programmable by a laptop computer. This allows a large degree of flexibility to adjust the system to suit your requirements.

The system shuts off gas flow when the brakes are applied or the driver’s foot comes off the accelerator.
The system can be switched on and off (if ever necessary) via a dash mounted switch. If gas is unavailable or you run out before a service station, it is not necessary to switch the system off. Instead you will notice a decrease in performance as the gas runs out. Since the diesel injection system is not modified, the vehicle will simply run on diesel as it did prior to the system being fitted

http://www.dieselgasaustralia.com.au/de ... =Technical
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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby KiwiBacon » Tue Apr 28, 2009 6:59 pm

vvega wrote:do you not understand what a load based fuel system is ?
the tps tells you how far your foot is down .. so therefore how much load your engine is under
and based on this the fuel is delivered

you talk of compensator's governors etc but im trying to keep this simple for you
thats why the decent fume kits have ecu control ... to offset and control the finer points of delivery

this was all in that very first artical i linked in the fume thread ... again you didn't read it so you cont understand
its said in black and white that air volume has NOTHING to do with fumigation rates
again you dont understand what you are talking about so how can you expect to get it right
just like boiling points and flash points , you just dont understand and you are doing it wrong
is any of this sinking through ?


I have read all the manufacturers speils.
They all bring us back to the one simple question.

At what point does lpg detonate in a diesel engine?

I've shown it detonating at 0.4% air volume, the amount of other fuel present can only mask the effects (more noise etc), it cannot suppress or otherwise switch off the detonation.

You've said it can't detonate below 2% air volume. But it does, the video shows that.

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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby mudzilla » Tue Apr 28, 2009 7:03 pm

Go .... to ..... the .... Fumeing .... thread .... It's near the top of the new post page :roll:
36" Simex's is as close as I get to gardening

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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby nivaman » Wed Apr 29, 2009 2:24 pm

Sorry guys this is a hydrogen thread not LPG.

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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby vvega » Wed Apr 29, 2009 2:43 pm

nivaman wrote:Sorry guys this is a hydrogen thread not LPG.

sorry mate ...
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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby ike » Mon May 11, 2009 9:49 am

just to anyone who doesn't believe in this stuff... it works. Some mates and i set one up for a cortina spa pool about three years ago. Gutted a mk5, lined and glassed it, had the motor running from a hoffman voltameter (basically a reverse battery with salty water in it) and although we never really got much power out of it (it would drive, but say goodbye to hills) it would cruise along for an hour or two on 20-30litres of water before needing to recharge the battery (disconnected the alternator and put an aircon pump in it's place so we could run bubbles through the pool)

We were fairly confindent of being able to make it fully driveable with reasonable power but ended up being made an offer we couldn't refuse so let it go before we could develop it further... ended up building a jet powered shopping trolley instead;-) (yes, it worked and you could drive it etc... faaaaarrkn dodgy though!!

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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby smurf182 » Mon May 11, 2009 11:13 am

ike wrote:just to anyone who doesn't believe in this stuff... it works. Some mates and i set one up for a cortina spa pool about three years ago. Gutted a mk5, lined and glassed it, had the motor running from a hoffman voltameter (basically a reverse battery with salty water in it) and although we never really got much power out of it (it would drive, but say goodbye to hills) it would cruise along for an hour or two on 20-30litres of water before needing to recharge the battery (disconnected the alternator and put an aircon pump in it's place so we could run bubbles through the pool)


Let me get this straight..

You used a battery to electrolyze water with a Hoffman voltameter and used the resulting gases to fuel an internal combustion engine?

Well thats cool.. no one here is saying you can't get hydrogen and oxygen by electrolyzing water.

What people are saying is electrolysis of water is a very inefficient process.. you would have been much much better off just putting in an electric motor and be done with it. (Not knocking what you did in any way just stating the reality).

The issue is some people claim that using one of these little electrolyzers to generate hydrogen and then feed it back into an engine results in fuel savings at the pump.. this would have to be an over-unity process (more than 100% efficient).. it is simply not possible in this universe.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_law_of_thermodynamics

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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby ike » Mon May 11, 2009 11:30 am

haha yeah sorry about that i kind of posted after reading the first couple of pages (ie didn't read right to the end).

Yes you are correct it would be impossible for this setup to be self sufficient (it would be like connecting a motor output shaft to a generator input shaft, connecting the wires, giving it a "twirl" and watching it spin forever...) not gonna happen;-)

we just did it to prove a point... it was mentioned one night on the turps and someone (apparently knowledgable) said it couldn't be done... so we had to do it;-) basically the amount of electrical power the voltameter was using would (theoretically) have to have been greater than the amount of potential power in the gas we were producing... would have been netter off using that same battery to power an electric motor, but then we don't have pistons! and i love pistons;-)

will wait til after work and have a full read through this topic, would be interesting;-)

The jet powered trolley was still cooler though, will have to try and dig up a video;-)

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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby flyingbrick » Mon May 11, 2009 7:09 pm

smurf182 wrote: much better off just putting in an electric motor and be done with it.


What i've actually found useful is rigging up a switch to engage the starter motor while at full throttle.

Helps while overtaking a shitload!

-Nathan



:mrgreen:
phone Ross Bolus (secretary of the BOP club) He'll save you.

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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby Atomant » Fri Jun 05, 2009 9:28 pm

Very late in joining this thread but I was approached by a guy not long ago at work and he asked me about the fuel consumption of my work van and we ended up talking about 4x4s, he has developed his own system and is keen to try it in a truck, I don't have the money to spare to try an unknown but if anyone wants to talk to this guy let me know and I can put you in touch. He claims to have installed about 20 of them and is willing to provide contact details for these people, he even gave me a couple along with his card.

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Re: Home made Hydrogen generator for my Feroza

Postby Smurf » Tue Jun 23, 2009 9:08 am


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