Using Tyres

[Bulletproof]

Fitzy asked what is my view of tyres -Simex verses BFGs etc
I have seen tyres go the full circle. Years ago every one ran SATs and they worked very well and on clay fire breaks in Nelson they are still the best tyre ever made.
Why were they so good? An SAT is basically a Tractor Tyre and has to be driven like a Tractor. They were very good on the landies, or any other vehicle that lacked power.
As power increased people started to use Radials because they could spin them and clear the shit and as an all round tire are still the best. User friendly on the Road and stll reasonably capable offroad'
There are tracks like at westport where there Roots etc and the tractor type tread on the Silverstones ,Simex are better and stronger.
The trend lately is for this type of tyre again. THE MISTAKE MOST MAKE IS THEY DONT DRIVE THEM AS A TRACTOR
With the power of modern trucks they charge there way through and all that happen is they go down as quick as forward and get stuck.
I have Simexs and BFGs and like both but you need to drive them accordingly.If I had to make a choice of just one would stick with 35x12.5 Mud terrain.
Richard

[nstg8a]

so if you were t use a SAT type tyre, would you better off with a narrow tyre, or a wide one?

[Bulletproof]

so if you were t use a SAT type tyre, would you better off with a narrow tyre, or a wide one?

If you lack power go for narrow otherwise I think the wide is better.
My choice is Simex 35.12 2lug not 3 which tends to be useless

[Bubba]

2 lug, 3 lug

Pictures please so I can tell the difference.

[wopass]

My choice is Simex 35.12 2lug not 3 which tends to be useless

i would dissagree with that, i have run the 36-12.5-15 triple centre lug centipede for two years now and have found them to be exceptional for bush,trials and road,having the tripple centre blocks makes them wear much better(last longer)which makes it better on the pocket and the outer blocks which do all the work are the same as the smaller centepedes, sure they arent as open in the middle but would i notice the difference ? only when they wore out after a couple of trips down the road and i get about half an inch more diff clearance

[rokhound]

The trend lately is for this type of tyre again. THE MISTAKE MOST MAKE IS THEY DONT DRIVE THEM AS A TRACTOR
With the power of modern trucks they charge there way through and all that happen is they go down as quick as forward and get stuck.

AND....rip the shit out of the ground, giving the greenies more ammo to use against us.

What Richard has stated is right on the money, and I have said the same thing lots of times on here. If you have big boots on your truck with aggressive tread, there should be absolutely no need to charge into a muddy track at 100 mph!
Try driving it slowly at first. If you don't make it, you can usually still back out. Then you have a feel for what is in there and can decide on how to drive it on your next run. (obviously this doesn't apply to the competition guys )

If the tracks don't get progressively destroyed by guys hammering big tyred rigs through them all the time, then maybe we will be able to retain access to them.
If you then find you can drive everything that is put in front of you and that the challenge isn't there any more, put smaller tyres on and have a go, Or come and play on the terrain I drive on (the environment always wins when shit goes wrong on rocks ).

Oh and on the thread topic , If I had to choose just one tyre to have for all uses, I think I would go with the 37" Goodyear MTR.
(but I love my 39.5" swampers )

[wopass]

2 lug



3 lug

[Bulletproof]

Wopass is right regarding driving Simexs on the road. The 2 lug wear out very quickly and are horrible to drive on under 40 pounds. It doesn't affect me because I carry tyres on the back and only use them offroad so I go for the ultimate traction.
Tractors dont have any lugs in the middle which is the best for forward motion.Blocks in the middle give side ways stability.
Actually the silverstones wear alot better on the road but are miles under size a 35 measure about 34.
Richard

[Bubba]

Arrrrrh now me understand, thanks wopass. Now when when people talk about 2 or 3 lug I will actually know what they are talking about instead of just nodding my head and hoping that no asks me questions

I know I'm not the only one out there that does it, well I hope not anyway

[Bubba]

Oh and on the thread topic , If I had to choose just one tyre to have for all uses, I think I would go with the 37" Goodyear MTR.
(but I love my 39.5" swampers )

Next question Rok; I thought the MTR weren't that good on heaver riggs, well thats what I have been told

[rokhound]

What do you class as heavy?
My POS weighs in at 2150 kg with 5.0ltr lump in the front.
A std surf weighs in at 1900 odd Kgs. Your middy 70 series would be around the 2000kg mark i guess. 40's are lighter and my old 60 is around 2300kgs. The weight thing gets bandyed about a lot, but unless you are in a competition rig, I don't believe it makes a whole lot of difference in the bigger picture.
I don't run MTRs, and to be fair I haven't spoken to any one who uses them on a daily driver, but I have seen them do some pretty awesome shit offroad for a radial.

[swampa]

in my opinion i would class, cruisers and saf's as heavy, my hilux weighs in under 1600kg,s, and i class it as lightish, i have in my garage, 35 inch bfg mt,s, 35 inch simex,s 35 inch swampers and 40 inch wranglers, i use the bfgs for around town and have taken them out for a play a few times and compared to my other tyres they are useless, dont care to much for the swampers as my truck is too light to get the best out of them and the wranglers, well they are just for posing, for my the simex 35x10.5 is miles ahead, even though they arent the best for a "few" situations like sidelings they are miles ahead in every other area

[Bulletproof]

This really raises another issue,tyre pressures
My Hilux weighs about 2100 which is a reasonable weight.When I run the simexs they are useless unless I drop the pressure to 10 or under.
The BFGs I nornally run around 20 but when I get serious go down to about 15. as an example at anzac Paul Delis and myself went up Petrol hill . Paul had 18 in his wranglers and drove straight up. I had 4 goes with 25 in my BFGs and didnt come close. I let them down to under 20 and drove up without any trouble at all. So I think pressures are more important than Tyres.
By the way in the winch challenge last year not single modified truck got up petrol hill and the majority were on simex an silverstone tyres. We went up on radials.
Richard

What do you class as heavy?
My POS weighs in at 2150 kg with 5.0ltr lump in the front.
A std surf weighs in at 1900 odd Kgs. Your middy 70 series would be around the 2000kg mark i guess. 40's are lighter and my old 60 is around 2300kgs. The weight thing gets bandyed about a lot, but unless you are in a competition rig, I don't believe it makes a whole lot of difference in the bigger picture.
I don't run MTRs, and to be fair I haven't spoken to any one who uses them on a daily driver, but I have seen them do some pretty awesome shit offroad for a radial.

[Bulletproof]

Another example of tyre pressure that taught me a valuable lesson dates back to the mid 90s. We were at a club trial and I was running SATs with 15 lbs. The grass was wet and I couldn't even take off on the course. Bob Dickinson an experienced trialer of the time said let your tyres down to 5lb. I did this and after that couldn't even get stuck.

Richard

[Browndog]

Ive done a lot of tests on sand 3 different trucks & tyres road psi (35) all made it half up dune drop to 20 three quarters up dune, 2 of us drop to 10 & strait over. It showed the new boys with no compressor wat it all about

[flynndod]

What are the mudzillas like as they look to be more like a tractor pattern??

[skid]

Oh and on the thread topic , If I had to choose just one tyre to have for all uses, I think I would go with the 37" Goodyear MTR.
(but I love my 39.5" swampers )

Next question Rok; I thought the MTR weren't that good on heaver riggs, well thats what I have been told

all htese questions bubba

anyone would think you may be in the market for tyres soon

[coxsy]

mtrs worked well on the mazda ute not so hot on a safari

[Bulletproof]

I can't comment on mudzillas as I have had no expierence with them.

Richard

[callum007]

i think most people in general run too higher pressures while off road.
Make the tyres bulge, gets them working. I run my swampers at 5psi. no i dont have bead locks, but the truck is only 1300kg. my 37" creepy crawlers wouldnt bulge till they were way under 10, so on road they got 15psi, off they got 3-5psi.. that was on a cruiser at 2300kg.

2 block centipedes work and clear far better than triple block if you asked me.. i'd like to run boggers for trails if i was able

[swampa]

my bfg's arent on beadlocks and if i'm going out with them i dont let them down as it is usually just for a play and most of the other guys are on 31 or 33s so i cant see the point, when taking the simex tyres i have the front at 8 and rear at 4 and there is hardly any bulge and they are on beadlocks, i have run the rears on 1 or 2 psi a few times just too see if there was much of a difference

[SMOKEY]

Richard, thanks for the topic, I appreciate and respect your knowledge on any topic. To all who don't know Bulletproof I can assure you that when he does something he has thought about it, fixed any mistakes and when someone says no he says yes.

SEE YOU IN THE MUD,

FITZY.

[Bulletproof]

Thanks for your compliments Fitzy. It is just that I like to challenge any accepted idea.

Going back to Callum and swampa I am with them all the way on running very low pressures off road. Many 4 wheel drivers won"t believe it. A foot print at 20 pounds is about 3 inchs where one at 5 lbs is about a foot.They are running bead locks which are the ulimate.
I run tractor tubes in the BFGs and simexs which can be let down in a couple of minutes by removing the valves and to date have had no problems.
Before I have them fitted, I sand all the shiney paint off the rims and paint them with a grit paint. When the tyre place fits the tyre I stand over them and wont let them use any soap.
Richard

Richard, thanks for the topic, I appreciate and respect your knowledge on any topic. To all who don't know Bulletproof I can assure you that when he does something he has thought about it, fixed any mistakes and when someone says no he says yes.

SEE YOU IN THE MUD,

FITZY.

[Passtime]

What pressure can you safely drop a Radial tyre (i'm running Cooper STT with tubes) Is it OK to drive on Forestry roads at low pressures while you are commuting between rough stuff.

[skid]

What pressure can you safely drop a Radial tyre (i'm running Cooper STT with tubes) Is it OK to drive on Forestry roads at low pressures while you are commuting between rough stuff.

without beadlocks on my 40 series cruiser, I have been as low as 6psi front and 3psi rear in the bush without popping off the beads

on the road I have driven at 140kph with only 12psi in the tyres and it is a handful but can be done. it wandered around on the corners quite a bit, but if I didn't keep up with the guy he was gonna lose me in his backyard forest that I knew nothing about

[Bulletproof]

So How do you tell the difference between a proper mud tyre that will work and an ordinary tyre?
Most people look at the big lugs on the simexs as opposed to the radials They certainly help but the secret of a genuine mud tyre is in the shape of the case.

Proper mud tyres have a case that is round like a tractor tyre. With this tyre even without being spun the mud squeezes out the side making them self cleaning. When they are half worn out still work reasonally well because the mud still squeezes out.
A radial has a case that is flat across the tread which makes them clog up. The only way to clean them is to spin them flat out, so unless you have the power to instantly spin them and then shut off again to gain traction they are useless.
As soon as the edges get worn they lose there affectiveness and if they are half worn as well you might as well have slicks because they they are next to useless.

bulletproof

[De-Ranged]

Before I have them fitted, I sand all the shiney paint off the rims and paint them with a grit paint. When the tyre place fits the tyre I stand over them and wont let them use any soap.

A nice simple clever idea

One I've used in the past is spray paint instead of a lube like soap.... when its wet it acts like a lube and when it dry's it sets like glue but thats me poping tyres on old school style don't know if you'll get a tyre shop to do that one

Good simple discription on how tyres work and differences, In fact its one of the best I've come across
Would you mind if I put them up in the tech section just save some of us long winded foke answering and re-answering these questions

[Bulletproof]

I dont mind at all if it is going to help someone

[lneil]

From what you I understand that, in your opinion, bias-ply would be better on the smaller vehicles without the power to readily spin the tyres for clearing? (ie. 1.6 'zuk)

[Weemsy]

i went out in my 1600 escudo today with SAT style tyres on and thought they were great. only got stuck once and thats cuz i bottomed out!! my scud is almost standard, just got a 25mm lift at the back, lifting it a bit more soon and the front is getting lifted this week i hope. im keeping the SATs though. they are great. and they wernt flicking mud up for a mile down the road.