X-Link on Safari

[DaveM]

You can buy slotted factory bushes, they make a small amount of flex difference apparently

[Shane]

Has anyone considered slotting the rear radius arm bush down and fitting a heavy spring under it to relieve the pressure ?

Richard

Nice "outside of the square" thinking there Richard.
Also who ever designed or first thought of the X-link is a clever chappie as well. This is the first time I have ever seen anything like this.
My only questionable practice is the welding of the hinge pin to the diff housing. There seems to be some pretty heavy welding involved. Would this not warp the diff housing? OK on an off-roader but not something you'd want on a truck which might see a fair few highway miles getting to and from play grounds.

They preload the diff when welding to stop it warping

[Bulletproof]

This is a little Warning to a potential Problem.

If you allow the axle to drop too much ,the 20mm bolt that holds the bushes at the other end of the radius rod can snap off.

This happened to a friend of mine. There are 2 options.

1 Cut the mount off the chassis and weld it on at a forward angle. Thats what him and I have done.

2 Buy after market Radius rods designed for big lifts.

Cheers Richard

[DaveM]

Drop boxes will also help, and would be a far cheaper option than drop arms

[DaveM]

This is with the new arm in mine, haven't really tried it out, the shocks limit the travel, but I can't afford longer ones at the moment, I just put these OME in yesterday, but could've gone longer

[Bulletproof]

Perhaps i'm thick or something ( leaving myself wide open here )

The clearance between the diff and the radius rod is about 10mm. My question is ,if the radius rod can't move up more than 10mm how can the other side drop more than 10mm because the X-link is only a see-saw. ?

Answers please .

Richard

[KiwiBacon]

Perhaps i'm thick or something ( leaving myself wide open here )

The clearance between the diff and the radius rod is about 10mm. My question is ,if the radius rod can't move up more than 10mm how can the other side drop more than 10mm because the X-link is only a see-saw. ?

Answers please .

Richard

Answer, you're right and it can't.
But that 10mm gap frees things up a lot. You get a lot more movement before you're again relying on squishing bushings to get more.

Any handling reviews yet? Nissan (and landrover and toyota) all used radius arms in the front because they have enough roll stiffness to keep the handling under control.

[DaveM]

before you're again relying on squishing bushings to get more.

Any handling reviews yet? Nissan (and landrover and toyota) all used radius arms in the front because they have enough roll stiffness to keep the handling under control.

From the outerlimits site from a chch member:


"Did a trip up Worsleys a few weeks ago with the ChCh club and he was there with his truck Shane. On road you could definitely see the truck tilting on corners...looked spooky!"

They are now available with a lockout system for on road use, but it depends on the use the vehicle is getting I guess. I went for the superior arm setup, as it maintains good road manners while still gaining flex, but the x-link offered more flex while sacraficing road manners more than I thought I would be comfortable with

[KiwiBacon]

They are now available with a lockout system for on road use, but it depends on the use the vehicle is getting I guess. I went for the superior arm setup, as it maintains good road manners while still gaining flex, but the x-link offered more flex while sacraficing road manners more than I thought I would be comfortable with

What is this "superior arm" setup?

[swampa]

not to sure but you can buy arms that have " superior" written on the side of them from oz

[DaveM]

Its a high flex arm designed by Superior Engineering in oz, a lot of comp guys are now using them, and can be purchased to suit a wide range of lifts, so very cost efferctive if looking at buying drop arms for more castor/strength.
I run standard height arms, and use the superior drop boxes, as this is meant to give the best handling, and allows the front to climb over objects better than drop arms.
The extra flex is very noticable, and I notice no handling difference on road, running a 3" lift with no swaybars. I now run out of travel with my 4" OME front shocks.
http://carl.outerlimits4x4.com/ftopic11 ... light=flex

[KiwiBacon]

Its a high flex arm designed by Superior Engineering in oz, a lot of comp guys are now using them, and can be purchased to suit a wide range of lifts, so very cost efferctive if looking at buying drop arms for more castor/strength.
I run standard height arms, and use the superior drop boxes, as this is meant to give the best handling, and allows the front to climb over objects better than drop arms.
The extra flex is very noticable, and I notice no handling difference on road, running a 3" lift with no swaybars. I now run out of travel with my 4" OME front shocks.
http://carl.outerlimits4x4.com/ftopic11 ... light=flex

Interesting thread there.
It seems they're using adapter plates to shift the location of the stock bushes and new arms to suit. It looks like one side arm has been designed to be partially hinged. Must give some interesting one-sided behaviour under braking, But I haven't read it all.

http://www.superiorengineering.com.au/i ... 00_400.jpg
http://www.superiorengineering.com.au/i ... 00_400.jpg
http://www.superiorengineering.com.au/i ... 400_01.jpg

[DaveM]

It seems they're using adapter plates to shift the location of the stock bushes and new arms to suit. It looks like one side arm has been designed to be partially hinged. Must give some interesting one-sided behaviour under braking, But I haven't read it all.

Strangely enough, I notice no difference at all under braking

[darinz]

Its a high flex arm designed by Superior Engineering in oz, a lot of comp guys are now using them, and can be purchased to suit a wide range of lifts, so very cost efferctive if looking at buying drop arms for more castor/strength.
I run standard height arms, and use the superior drop boxes, as this is meant to give the best handling, and allows the front to climb over objects better than drop arms.
The extra flex is very noticable, and I notice no handling difference on road, running a 3" lift with no swaybars. I now run out of travel with my 4" OME front shocks.
http://carl.outerlimits4x4.com/ftopic11 ... light=flex

Nissan front shocks are way too short. You need to increase the height of the shock tower and fit longer shocks. 80 series LC shocks are perfect for a GQ/GU and all you need to do is space the front towers up 60mm to stop the shock bottoming out. 80 series shocks are 30% longer but have the same valving as GQ/GU shocks.
That is what I run (but twins) and have just done it to a mates truck. ie his is 2" lift with 80 seires shocks with towers spacers up 60 mm. With a 3" lift you only need to space up 55mm as coil bind happens before that anyway. With a 3" (or greater) lift you are getting coil bind before the bump stops and so will bend your diff housing. either space the bumpstop or replace it with something else. eg hydraulic is best but $$$$.

Doing as above will give you about an extra 100mm of down travel with the same handling!!

Also I should add, flex is over rated unless you are rock crawling. Just use lockers instead!!

[DaveM]

Nissan front shocks are way too short. You need to increase the height of the shock tower and fit longer shocks. 80 series LC shocks are perfect for a GQ/GU and all you need to do is space the front towers up 60mm to stop the shock bottoming out. 80 series shocks are 30% longer but have the same valving as GQ/GU shocks.
With a 3" (or greater) lift you are getting coil bind before the bump stops and so will bend your diff housing. either space the bumpstop or replace it with something else. eg hydraulic is best but $$$$.

Doing as above will give you about an extra 100mm of down travel with the same handling!!

Also I should add, flex is over rated unless you are rock crawling. Just use lockers instead!!

The problem I had was that I couldn't do a body lift to extend the towers, being an airbagged GU, so run L sreies shocks at the moment, but as I have just bought an old GQ, I will be swapping parts over, doing the bodylift, and 80 fronts.

Any idea on how to extend the existing bump stops? Haven't tried, but it look awkward being inside the coil and the way they mount. Can I extend the bottom instead?

I only went for the extra flex as I felt it would balance the vehicle a little better off road, and for the driving I do, a locker will come after the winch, but it is on the long list of mods for the future


Cheers,
Dave

[Mud Hog]

Another thread about bulletproofs hilux

That's not a very good way to treat a member who has got more to offer this forum than most of the other dribblers on here. Richard does after all have Nissan control arms on his HiLux, he is constantly looking for ways to improve his vehicle and is ready and willing to share information. I find his," is there a better way attitude" to be the reason that a lot of us read these topics and thus get to modify our own vehicles.
I'm following this topic with interest the same as i followed your build topic.

BE NICE TO OTHERS AND IT WILL COME BACK TO YOU,

FITZY.

Bloody oats the more Bullet proof posts the better in my eyes, always a good read.(learning off him)

[Shane]

Tony made up a better travel ramp(longer and safer)has it pretty much spot on at 20 deg's,I'm going to have a play this weekend see if I can sort out shock lenghts for front.He's getting over 1000 RTI which I think is quite good??

Shane

[Muzza]

Regarding how these Superior Engineering arms work

KiwiBacon said -
Interesting thread there.
It seems they're using adapter plates to shift the location of the stock bushes and new arms to suit. It looks like one side arm has been designed to be partially hinged. Must give some interesting one-sided behaviour under braking, But I haven't read it all.

Thats what it looks like to me.


Lower diagram is of standard control arm

So why dont we just pull a front or rear axle bolt out of one of our standard radius arms as it would have a similar effect. I have driven it like this when testing tyre / guard clearances and it certainly increases travel alot and seems to work OK . It can be reinserted again for road use just like a quick disconnect pin.

[/img]

When I last spoke to Dobbin's Engineering ( about 6 months ago ) they said they didn't have a locking mechanism on their Xlink's and guys were just using their swaybars.

Anyone building Xlinks in NZ

Cheers

[mercutio]

okay now i know what the next mod is on the g

[KiwiBacon]

So why dont we just pull a front or rear axle bolt out of one of our standard radius arms as it would have a similar effect. I have driven it like this when testing tyre / guard clearances and it certainly increases travel alot and seems to work OK . It can be reinserted again for road use just like a quick disconnect pin.

It'll make life hard for the bush that remains and it'll dive to one side a little under braking. Otherwise yeah it's ugly but simple and it works.

[mercutio]

okay now i know what the next mod is on the g

but then again i have lockers and i don't go rock crawling

[Muzza]

Just another pic to show the Superior arrangement. Is this right Dave ?
Am I missing something or am I right that just pulling a bolt works on the similar principle as the Superior arms. ?
Because if it is then I would be concerned with reliability. Imagine the torque going thru just one arm and like KiwiBacon said

It'll make life hard for the bush that remains and it'll dive to one side a little under braking. Otherwise yeah it's ugly but simple and it works.

No ! I don't go rockcrawling and I have a front locker so I agree that extreme articulation is not required. For me stability is very important and so have not done a bodylift prefering to chop the guards instaed and only have a 50mm spring lift as I prefer to keep my weight low, But I would like to give my front end a little more flex ( incorporating 80 series shocks ) and make it more supple so it balances the back end better. I beleive this would improve traction and stability. Whatever I end up doing I want good road manners so might have to lock it out for road use.

Cheers

[DaveM]

I have tried with the radius bolt removed, and it improves flex, and wrecks bushings, and can't be driven on road safely, I have found no difference in braking with the Superior Arm, I don't know the science behind exactly how it works, all I know is it does a good job, and is fine for on road driving.

I'm told that the latest version of the x-link has the locking mech. and there is a guy on TM who is about to start making high flex arms, not sure what design they will be, but I'll be sticking to the proven oz designs. If simply pulling the front radius bolt was good enough, I'm sure everyone would be doing it, and the flex arms wouldn't be getting purchased and rave reviews like they have been

[Shane]

It'll make life hard for the bush that remains and it'll dive to one side a little under braking. Otherwise yeah it's ugly but simple and it works.

What makes you think it well dive to one side?its a solid axle not inderpendent...
Why well it make life hard on the bush?
What bush are you talking about?std has 4 bushes,with superflex arm has 4 bushes...

Shane

[Muzza]

Duuurrrrrrr Finally got it

I looked and looked on the net for a pic of how the modified arm attached to the back of the front axle but can not find one. In the mean time the penny finally dropped. ( I will blame it on my brain still being in holiday mode )
I had been asumming that the modified arm was only attached at the front bolt "A" but in fact must be attached at both original positions. A and B in pic.



I can now see why they work. The distance between points B and C is shorter than the original A and B so the arm can stroke further for the same amount of bush deflection.
Brilliant.

All I need to work out now is how to correct my castor after the 50mm lift. Not enough for drop boxes but probably needs to have about 1.5 degrees to get back to original. Truck handles allright but I am just fussy.
I see Superior might be bringing the flex arms out for 50mm lift correction which would solve both of my problems.

Cheers

[DaveM]

I run a 3" lift, with a Superior Flex arm, and a factory arm with drop boxes.
While I could have bought the 2 arms, the weight for the othe arm on the flight was too much, and I wanted to run drop boxes instead of drop arms. Will be going up to a 4" lift next, with heavier rear coils, lighter front, to get the front flexing better, and running 700mm long front shocks

[KiwiBacon]

It'll make life hard for the bush that remains and it'll dive to one side a little under braking. Otherwise yeah it's ugly but simple and it works.

What makes you think it well dive to one side?its a solid axle not inderpendent...
Why well it make life hard on the bush?
What bush are you talking about?std has 4 bushes,with superflex arm has 4 bushes...

Shane

I'm talking about removing a bolt from one radius arm.
Under braking the braking torque from your wheels is resisted by the radius arms, they produce an upward lifting force at their ends. If you "hinge" one of them, then that side will have no upwards lifting force under braking, the other side then takes all.
The result is the truck trying to dive to one side under braking. How far it dives depends on your front springs.

The superior arm setup will also do this, but in a much reduced way, some people might not even feel the difference but it is still happening.

[stainless]

hey
iam now making a flex arm based on the superior arm. sould be ready for sale after easter.
we will be giving the 175kw turbo test truck a bashing in reefton over easter.
the new arm is cnc cut from biz80 20mm plate and will fitt standed nissan bushes and is bolt in..
giving a fantastic incress in travel also keeping on road manners.
cost will be about $500 nzd ready to go with bushes, zinc plated and powder coated.

lets keep nz$ in nz

steve
advantage 4wd

[Jofsee]

hey
iam now making a flex arm based on the superior arm. sould be ready for sale after easter.
we will be giving the 175kw turbo test truck a bashing in reefton over easter.
the new arm is cnc cut from biz80 20mm plate and will fitt standed nissan bushes and is bolt in..
giving a fantastic incress in travel also keeping on road manners.
cost will be about $500 nzd ready to go with bushes, zinc plated and powder coated.

lets keep nz$ in nz

steve
advantage 4wd

jeez steve,
Well done you must be a real bright spark to get on a international forum and boast how stupid you really are ,because you have to copy someone else's design.
You say lets keep NZ dollars here in NZ " more like your pocket.
The reason Superior Engineering sells products all over the world , is because they do have engineer's that do design and manufacture top quality products, unlike your rubbish.
After looking at your prior posts and pictures of your products i wouldnt let you give me a part to put on my truck as i reckon it would fail.
Nice drop boxes they look like they came out of the bin.

Mate you can't even spell correctly so its no wonder you can't design anything for yourself.
Get a life and go to school and grow up.
I really hope Superior Engineering take you to court and owns your ass, just because i dont like people who suck of others.

[Jezza]

Farken Aussies all over the place now