What first, Lock-Right locker or Runva winch? POLL

[Slideways]

Im trying to decide where my money is best spent.

I have a MWB FRP Landcruiser with Holden V6 and auto, EFS elite front shocks, 33" muds and standard ride height. Its has been pretty good offroad so far but I think the main limiting factor is that it has no lsd's or lockers at all.

I'm on a low budget and do most of the work myself but have no experience with rebuilding diff heads so wouldn't know where to start with fitting the Lock-Right so will probably have to factor in the fitment cost. While I'd be installing the winch myself.

Not sure which winch to get either would 10,000lbs be enough?

Lock Right would be in the rear simply due to less likely problems vs's fitting to the front.

[wopass]

you can do both mate, the lockright in the 9" cruiser diff is so simple to fit its just plain easy if you can pull the diff head out you can fit the lockright.

if i had to choose tho i would say get the winch first, a locker in the rear will get you further offroad but the winch will get you home

[monstr]

Personally if it were me i would fit the winch first ,a couple of reasons are there are trips that require winches ,and in the end if you get stuck at least you can get yourself out ,even us with lockers F&R still get stuck and have to winch ourselves out of the sh#t ,I would think a 10000 lb winch would be enough just get yourself a pully block for the times you get really buried ..cheers

[fweddy]

a locker in the rear will get you further offroad but the winch will get you home

Wisdom here! ^

A locker might make your vehicle more capable but the winch is more of a value.

A locker might make you less likely to get stuck but the winch will get you out of anywhere the locker would get you through and more.

[Slideways]

Good point about the winch being the one to get me home

you can do both mate, the lockright in the 9" cruiser diff is so simple to fit its just plain easy if you can pull the diff head out you can fit the lockright.

if i had to choose tho i would say get the winch first, a locker in the rear will get you further offroad but the winch will get you home

I'd love to be able to fit a winch as well as a rear locker but the budget is what stops that one! Maybe at some stage though...

Out of interest can anyone describe what would need to be done to fit a lock-right or even point me to a website manual?

I would think a 10000 lb winch would be enough just get yourself a pully block for the times you get really buried ..cheers

Is 10,000 just cutting it or plenty for my cruiser which im guessing is probably about 2.5ton? Im guessing the pulley block is to multiply the pulling power... I've read about this but haven't quite got my head around it

[albundy]

lockers will get you into shit, how you gonna get out. I have found if you have lockers and get into the shit, you are really in the shit and a simple snatch/tow pull will not do you any good, the winch will. There are others out there that say fit the winch last.
Al

[swampa]

i always used to go out in a group with 4 or 5 others that all had winches, i never went out by myself, or was i the first in line, so traction was my first priority, when i started to think about being on my own then i got the winch

[wopass]

http://www.ih8mud.com/tech/woody/ez-lock.html

fitting guide and step by step how to

[Heath]

a locker in the rear will get you further offroad but the winch will get you home

Wisdom here! ^

A locker might make your vehicle more capable but the winch is more of a value.

A locker might make you less likely to get stuck but the winch will get you out of anywhere the locker would get you through and more.

I agree better to have an out than just an inroad to getting stuck. Remember the more capable the vehicle is the worse the stuckages become.

[rokhound]

i always used to go out in a group with 4 or 5 others that all had winches, i never went out by myself, or was i the first in line, so traction was my first priority, when i started to think about being on my own then i got the winch

I agree with this statement 100%. If you are going alone or with only 1 other, winches have to be a pretty useful thing to have. But if there are winches with the group you go with, why bother.
If you are going electric in the winch, I would suggest that you make it removable, so it can live inside the truck. I have never seen an electric winch that I would consider to be 100% reliable as they all seem to fill up with muddy silt and shit. And guess when your electric winch is going to let you down .
I realise that winch challenge guys might have some cool pressurised tricks up their sleeves, but for the average joe (who isn't going to spend 2-3k on a winch) it is not really an option. If the winch is removable, then rearward pulls are more of an option as well. Think about it, if you drove to where you are stuck, there is a pretty good chance that you can back out of there as well.

[monstr]

swampa wrote:
i always used to go out in a group with 4 or 5 others that all had winches, i never went out by myself, or was i the first in line, so traction was my first priority, when i started to think about being on my own then i got the winch


I agree with this statement 100%. If you are going alone or with only 1 other, winches have to be a pretty useful thing to have. But if there are winches with the group you go with, why bother
The above statement is the sort of thing that really gets on my nerves,and is the reason that on some of the trips i run if you havent got a working winch you dont go ,to many times either myself or other trucks on the run have broken either winch ropes or ather gear getting trucks out of the crapp whos owner couldnt be bothered getting a winch and never has their been an offer to replace it ."Let the Flameing Begin"

[Windsock]

...a locker in the rear will get you further offroad but the winch will get you home

Its all been said in the thread above but you can't go past this quote here, sums it all up, well done wopass. Winch first.

[Bulletproof]

swampa wrote:
i always used to go out in a group with 4 or 5 others that all had winches, i never went out by myself, or was i the first in line, so traction was my first priority, when i started to think about being on my own then i got the winch


I agree with this statement 100%. If you are going alone or with only 1 other, winches have to be a pretty useful thing to have. But if there are winches with the group you go with, why bother
The above statement is the sort of thing that really gets on my nerves,and is the reason that on some of the trips i run if you havent got a working winch you dont go ,to many times either myself or other trucks on the run have broken either winch ropes or ather gear getting trucks out of the crapp whos owner couldnt be bothered getting a winch and never has their been an offer to replace it ."Let the Flameing Begin"

X2

Thats why I mainly do private trips . Janets says to me, why should we stuff our truck to help others who won't spend the money on a winch.

A winch is the only thing that makes a truck really capable. I took Jafa out in Reefton a couple of weeks ago and as modified and awesome as his truck is on 40 inch tyres ,it still got stuck and he needed a tow.

Cheers Richard

[DieselBoy]

I'm old skool 4WD, and believe that a winch is an optional extra, it s just an insurence policy for the times you acidentally get yourself into trouble when you are buy your self, and didn't mean to, i.e, you where tyring to get to that awesome camp site just over there, looked alright, but hey, that shouldn't have happened and now you sideways accross the greasy hill, and the winch is the only way out, as there in no one to tow you.

On a trip, a winch is a waste of space unless its on the lead vehicle.

Snatching and controlled towing is far more effective and alot quicker.

Fit the dif lock, it will mean you can drive more stuff and be on the end of the rope less. Getting stuck less means less need for recoveries in general, even further reducing the need for the winch, and when you do get stuck the vehicle in front can pull you through, or the truck behind can pull you back.

I reckon there is nothing worse on a trip that a guy in a truck with little tyres and no traction aids and an expensive electric winch getting stuck every 20 meters and using his winch cause he doesn't want to get towed while every one is hanging around bashing their heads against their rollcages waiting for the slow process of setting the winch, winching, putting it away etc, especially when everyone else had driven that obstacle.

Gotraction aids and big tyres, then when you do get stuck, you aren't really that stuck and a simple tow is all you need.

Then worry about the winch for those times you venture off buy your self and have an ooops

my $20:00

[Sadam_Husain]

Winch vs Locker is all subjective to what you do, where you go and who you go with, theres no right or wrong answer

On a trip, a winch is a waste of space unless its on the lead vehicle.

Not dissagreeing with your whole post at all DB but I was winching the lead vehicle through the rollercoaster recently when I was third in line after a couple of winch meltdowns from the front.... shit we'd still be in there otherwise

[J_Dub]

ide go for the winch first. From my own point of view i would get out a bit more if i had a winch as i never go out alone, as i aint got a winch, and the 2 times that i learnt my lesson, first time waited an hour till help arrived after driving thru a foot a water on a river bank... sweet, till i hit a hole and sunk, water inside up to dash , rear locker wouldnt have helped as both rears were up in the air, 2nd time fishing out the river mouth, stayed till dark as fishing was good, driving back thru the dunes along side mouth and thick mud and silt was around due to recent storm, so i sunk up to the chassis, no phone coverage so we camped out the night, then at day break did the 2 hour walk to find a guy with a tractor so since then i dont go alone, or atleast anywhere i dont wana get stuck.... till i get me winch.....

[aroma]

I would go the winch
but can u fit a pto instead of electric I know if your engine isn't running it wont work from memory there was one on t m off a landcrusier cant remember what they wanted sorry

[tallsam66]

Id go for the LOCK-RITE first...its what ive done are here is my logic.

Like you im on a budget....its the best performance enhancement you can get for you dollars.As i now have heaps more traction at the rear.I can with much less effort go up small banks etc meaning much less stress on my vehicle.Previously i had to often use speed & momentum to get across some obsticles.
The installation cost of a lock rite is very cheap...i paid $80 to have the locker professionally installed by the seller of the lockrite...i took the head in for him to do it .I decided to pay as i wanted to ensure it was installed correctly & also it means if i have a problem with it there is no comeback on the setup of the diff head.All up it cost me about $850 to do the whole job (lock rite, installation,new oil, new diff head seal & remote diff breather )

I thought of buying a winch instead.but by the time i made a new front bar, possibly new battery x2 did a whoile heap of wiring etc it would of been way more expensive to do ...so at the moment its out of my budget.
Also id get a 12000 lb winch..a big winch wont have to work as hard as a smaller winch....big is best when your talking winches.

[rokhound]

Winch vs Locker is all subjective to what you do, where you go and who you go with, theres no right or wrong answer

On a trip, a winch is a waste of space unless its on the lead vehicle.

Not dissagreeing with your whole post at all DB but I was winching the lead vehicle through the rollercoaster recently when I was third in line after a couple of winch meltdowns from the front.... shit we'd still be in there otherwise

This is probably the only correct response you we are going to get on this topic. If everyone wanted to drive the same shit, and do the same things, we would all drive exactly the same rigs that have been built to exactly the same spec. The statement earlier about using your winch to haul others is fairly valid, but I would cautiously like to ask those who USE their winches what the proportional useage factor is for them winching themselves, verses winching others.
I'm not against winches in any way shape or form, they are one of the most important safety features you can add to your rig, what pisses me off is guys who go out and purposely outdrive both the trucks and their own ability while relying on the fact that it is no worries, I can winch through. As stated by DB, I am old school as well, you should only be driving on trips that are suited to your ability and rigs capability.
When you are doing Grade 5 and worse trips, I suggest that there will always be more than 2 trucks, and less than 7ish. At this level you should only be playing with seriously set up trucks and drivers to match. (bulletproof type trips) When you are at this level, i would assume that most people are fairly aware of what they can and can't do, and when attempting things where there is a high chance of recovery being required, there is always a rig with a winch on (or strap) ready. This is kinda hard to explain, but if you are driving at this level, you know exactly what I am talking about, and at the end of the day,
Bragging rights go to the guy who managed to drive such and such an obstacle, not the one who had to use his winch to self recover the most.

[furnace]

Winch vs Locker is all subjective to what you do, where you go and who you go with, theres no right or wrong answer

On a trip, a winch is a waste of space unless its on the lead vehicle.

Not dissagreeing with your whole post at all DB but I was winching the lead vehicle through the rollercoaster recently when I was third in line after a couple of winch meltdowns from the front.... shit we'd still be in there otherwise

This is probably the only correct response you we are going to get on this topic. If everyone wanted to drive the same shit, and do the same things, we would all drive exactly the same rigs that have been built to exactly the same spec. The statement earlier about using your winch to haul others is fairly valid, but I would cautiously like to ask those who USE their winches what the proportional useage factor is for them winching themselves, verses winching others.
I'm not against winches in any way shape or form, they are one of the most important safety features you can add to your rig, what pisses me off is guys who go out and purposely outdrive both the trucks and their own ability while relying on the fact that it is no worries, I can winch through. As stated by DB, I am old school as well, you should only be driving on trips that are suited to your ability and rigs capability.
When you are doing Grade 5 and worse trips, I suggest that there will always be more than 2 trucks, and less than 7ish. At this level you should only be playing with seriously set up trucks and drivers to match. (bulletproof type trips) When you are at this level, i would assume that most people are fairly aware of what they can and can't do, and when attempting things where there is a high chance of recovery being required, there is always a rig with a winch on (or strap) ready. This is kinda hard to explain, but if you are driving at this level, you know exactly what I am talking about, and at the end of the day,
Bragging rights go to the guy who managed to drive such and such an obstacle, not the one who had to use his winch to self recover the most.

HERE,HERE ,VERY WELL SAID

[tpft]

"lock right" and spread the budget a little more and a highlift jack and winch kit. practice recovering with it b4 hand .
good idea to have as a back up anyway, so u can really bury vechile with confidennce. (especailly with chinese winches)

[J_Dub]

why not get the winch, then get a rear l.s.d, shop around and you will find one for couple hundy, then you fixed both issues, most will say l.s.d not as good as locker but beter than nothing at all and at fraction of the price

[shortylux]

Let the rant begin!
Im floored by some of these answers.

First the disclaimer. "it depends on what your doing".
It looks like you have an exploring/serious touring/bush type truck. Not a rock crawler. Not a trials truck.

Next some morals. How dare anyone expect a recovery when they are not setup to recover someone else. If the other guy only has a snatch strap and a spade, then you only need the same, but by jees dont be thinking "if we're both stuck he will winch us out"

Given that you have a bush truck (?), i assume you often go 4wding for the challenge? if so you will be pushing the limits of your ability and your gear (thats the fun part isnt it?). unplanned things WILL happen. Like many have said "a locker gets you in to the shit, the winch gets you out"

If you go the locker, it is my opinion that you need to have say $400 in the glove box to pay UPFRONT a deposit to the dude who is going to f#@k his gear to get you out. (yes i have been the recipient of some good recoveries and no I have not paid a cent, but these people know that I am both willing and capable to help when its them in the mud)

oh yeah,like Rok (or DB?) said, dont be that painful guy who must use his winch when a snatch will do. And dont assume that because you have a winch you are now bullet proof.

and as always, big ups to the dude who drove it!

[Jerry]

Fitting the lockrite is easy.... just supply beer and BBQ and organise a day for the Welly crew

PM Nizsafari as he can get them for a good price

[wjw]

I would say if you are doing grade 4 and below (most club trips) I would go the locker, as most people on those sorts of trips only have snatch straps and rope. In the central club I can only think of one occasion when a winch was needed to recover somone.

However, if you want to do the grade 5 plus trips like the ones bulletproof runs, or go out exploring on your own, then you should have a winch. The issue is not getting your truck getting stuck, its your truck dying and needing to be moved.

There is of course the other issue of the time it takes to recover a stuck truck on a grade 5 without a winch, but in the previous statement I'm assuming your with mates who won't mind spending the time.

All I can say is, I went lockers first, while I waited for a cheap ($400) winch to come up on trademe.

[NJV6]

oh yeah,like Rok (or DB?) said, dont be that painful guy who must use his winch when a snatch will do.

Agreed with your post. But this bit ^, when you are set up for winching it won't take any longer to get out of your predicament then a snatch and it is much more controlled and easier on gear.

I have had a winch for alot longer than lockers.

[darinz]

Some pretty good coments and I'll 2nd (or 3rd or whatever) the coment about being prepared to pay someone if they break their gear recovering you becuase you are out of your depth. I have a pretty well setup truck and because I drive most things on club trips you get expected to recover others. Most of the time this isn't an issue but their is always the wanker that shouldn't be on the trip, slows everyone down and requires everyone else to help them without being in the position to help others.
I say save your money and buy a winch that will get the job done every time, or buy a second hand one. The number of cheap chinese winches I've seen fail (either blow up or just not be capable) is rediculous. All they really achieve is to give people a false sense of security. The worse thing is to have gear that doesn't work properly.
So do less to your truck and have each mod done better as in the long run you'll get a better, cheaper truck.

[Slideways]

Thanks for all of the input and opinions guys Lots of good advice and info.

I ended up buying another cruiser to build up which already has a PTO (read: park bench seat). So once I get this on the road I'll be looking into the rear locker

PTO is obviously much better than having nothing but the appoach angle is horrible!! I'll be modifying the bumper but will leave the PTO position as is for now. Hopefully its not going to be a pain in the arse..

[zookfest]

reading thru all that i was thinking dude you have a cruiser that accepts a pto and rite at the end u have one.i know the bench seat u mean my pto has the shaft run up higher and the shaft feeds into a slip yoke with a sprocket and is chain driven and sits up way higher so you can think about ways of modding it and getting rid of that shiney crap

+ you will have a beast of an engine driving that winch soon

[UBZ]

If you are going electric in the winch, I would suggest that you make it removable, so it can live inside the truck. I have never seen an electric winch that I would consider to be 100% reliable as they all seem to fill up with muddy silt and shit. And guess when your electric winch is going to let you down .
I realise that winch challenge guys might have some cool pressurised tricks up their sleeves, but for the average joe (who isn't going to spend 2-3k on a winch) it is not really an option. If the winch is removable, then rearward pulls are more of an option as well. Think about it, if you drove to where you are stuck, there is a pretty good chance that you can back out of there as well.

This is what im planing on doing.
Removable winch that can be mounted front or rear. We are also going to set up/ wire up my mates truck the same so that the winch can be used by two different vehicles.

The best thing I ever brought was my Tirfor Hand winch. Slow to use but has got me out of some serious self induced shit while exploring..
Normally by pulling myself out backwards.