Friendship reconstruction!!

[Flash2004]

The Madaz068 episode is at an end. There are still fingers being pointed and I see in one thread in particular the resulting damage is lingering and potentially even more damaging.

We need to consider the person in question is a world class act. I don't think we've seen the end of him either, he learns as he goes along and we'll likely see him pop up at some time in the future under another new name, probably as elected prime minister of some Pacific Island. He was that good at manipulation of ordinay folk and still is. There has hardly been a single person in here and in many clubs who has not been taken in, at least initially, by Madaz's very clever approach. Some of those now most vocal in denouncing him were equally vocal in his support beforehand. So don't feel bad about being duped, you were in good company.

More importantly now, don't be attacking others who also allowed themselves to fall under his spell. At the time you, were possibly just as bad and that was part of his devious design. Some of you who overstepped the mark completely have some apologising to do and I don't mean to me. I mean to Bob Packard and Craig Lilford of Kiwi4x4 at least who tried their best to protect their club armed with whatever they had. So their ammunition was a bit blunt at times, so was yours in reply to it.

If we are indeed "MEN" in here and brothers in our fraternity, we will consider our past actions through this very carefully and we should consider whether to apologise just as publicly as our accusations were aired.

I will start the ball rolling by apologising sincerely to every person on here whose feelings were injured or hurt as collateral damage by my own part in this. if I singled you out for a written towelup and you took offence then I apologise.

If you feel like apologising, and you feel that you might patch some wounds and add to the greater good by doing it, after some serious soul searching, then do it here.

if you accept an apology and want to get along with what we do best, then do it here.

Thank you, Gordon Burnside

[DieselBoy]

If we are indeed "MEN" in here and brothers in our fraternity, we will consider our past actions through this very carefully and we should consider whether to apologise just as publicly as our accusations were aired.

Well said, a bit of unity in the face of adversity never went amiss, especially in this instance.

[vvega]

personally gordon i dont think ignorance or falling underthe "spell" is a excuse for anything
im happy to eat my pie and apologise for my 2 days of ignorance before i figured out what was actually going on below face value
more specifically sorry gordy

[Flash2004]

personally gordon i dont think ignorance or falling underthe "spell" is a excuse for anything
im happy to eat my pie and apologise for my 2 days of ignorance before i figured out what was actually going on below face value
more specifically sorry gordy

Thank you Wayne, and I see your input in the hydraulics field (in other posts) and believe its going to be very welcome, invaluable information to many of us. This sort of stuff is why this forum is so useful to us! cheers, Gordon

[Dace]

I have to agree with a lot of what you have said Gordon, but a lot of the partys on all sides of the arguements did not handle things well, this goes for Myself, You, Ryan, Bob and Craig and while it is easy to blame Nick for all the trouble, we all contributed to it and made it into the big shit pile it became.

now the man up part

I apologise to Bob for my actions and comments on the Kiwi site that contributed toward the trouble, and for my pointed posts with underlying jabs at you on various ORE threads. I DO look forward to meeting you this weekend at Wainui and hope ya will join me for a beer or 3

next, I apologise to Craig, again for my comments on the Kiwi site and the fact you felt compelled to resign from ya position as Secretary of the club. I have considered you a friend previous to this and hope we can be again in the future. IF Craig is no longer following the ORE forums, I would appreciate if someone could fwd this to him.

And Gordon, I find it hard to apologise to you because some of your actions have been reprehensible also, I won't go into details but the fact you have started this thread, I have to say, goes someway towards making up for it and will have to admit a little respect to you for it.

yours sincerely
Dave
aka Dace

[Moriarty]

To:

Ryan Kelly for giving him the wrong impression, not realising that my style is not universal.

for this, Ryan, I apologise.

B

[wisard2]

I have to agree with Gordon, and with Dace, in what they have had to say.

I am a firm believer in standing up for, and fighting for what I believe in, and for defending friends.

However, I recently became involved in a shit fight on Kiwi, and unfortunately a lot of the stuff reverted to personal attacks. I was a major participant in that.

In hindsight, and looking back over it all, and knowing now what I didn't at the time, I owe certain people an apology.

First and foremost, I owe Bob Packard an apology for attacking him, and embarrassing him. I know I have previously sent you a PM Bob, but please accept this as a public apology.

Craig, again, as with Bob, I owe you an apology for the personal attack on you , and also as with Bob, I sent you a PM of apology, but please also accept this public apology.

Gordon, my apology for anything personal I have posted on the Whanga threads last year. Again, in hindsight, there are things we know now that we didn't at the time, but that is still no excuse for personal attacks made in public, so my apologies to you also.

To anyone else who feels that my postings have caused them offense, my apologies to them also.

Lets put all this behind us and start afresh and get out there 4x4ing.

[Jerry]

I guess it only fair for me to put my 5 cents in here.....

Firstly I wish to apologise Gordon over a recent post on a thread which then by further posts by what we now know a fictitious user made some personal attacks against gordon and his wife, my post was in defence of an apparent new user which I saw Gordon attacking....my intention was never to support a blatent personal attack.

I also apologise to anyone else that I have personally attacked over recent events.

On what has happened, What has happened has happened and we can't wind that back, people on "both sides" of this saga have done things and made comments that were not in the spirit of our thriving 4wd community. I usually aim to sit on the proverbial fence but recently I appear to have fallen off on one side. At the moment I am focussing on getting back on the fence and sorting out my pos and continuing to organising trips.

PS Gordon..that invite from the welly crew for us to host your club for a weekend of mud at Rallywoods is still open....

[vvega]

I am a firm believer in standing up for, and fighting for what I believe in, and for defending friends.

as am i
i hope you can accept my intentions were honerable but non the less the wrong way to go about this
you have my apologys and as promised my posts are gone

will buy you a beer

[Dace]

PS Gordon..that invite from the welly crew for us to host your club for a weekend of mud at Rallywoods is still open....

Here here, I like this idea, bring Bob and Craig also

[Flash2004]

I certainly like the way this thread is heading. Most importantly I like and admire the way you guys have displayed considerable personal guts and credibility in posting what you have, in the way you have. Bloody well done, all of you.

[PR]

NOW EVERYBODY

[Moriarty]

NO Paul, NOT hugging anybody who is not actually my wife.

Manhugs are reserved for very few people, and then with great reluctance.

so..... NO and just in case you are deaf...... NO.

[Flash2004]

NO Paul, NOT hugging anybody who is not actually my wife.

Manhugs are reserved for very few people, and then with great reluctance.

so..... NO and just in case you are deaf...... NO.

You're so old school Bob. Don't you know its OK now to do hugs with blokes? I see blokes hugging all the time on my trips out of Taranaki, (which is a man hug free zone) mostly they're lycra clad cyclists doing it which might explain that other great mystery, of why male cyclists often shave their legs.

But seriously, I think man hugging man is here to stay but should not be done on 4x4 trips or events. Denny Crane (Bill Shatner - Boston legal) does it with his best mate Al, I do it a bit, on the sly of course, because if I figure if I hug the bloke, I also and by right get to hug the female companions as well. Think about it. One hug with (hopefully) no bumps, gets others with bumps. For some of us, its the only chance we'd get. And you know who you are.

[Moriarty]

You're so old school Bob. Don't you know its OK now to do hugs with blokes? I see blokes hugging all the time on my trips out of Taranaki, (which is a man hug free zone) mostly they're lycra clad cyclists doing it which might explain that other great mystery, of why male cyclists often shave their legs.

But seriously, I think man hugging man is here to stay but should not be done on 4x4 trips or events. Denny Crane (Bill Shatner - Boston legal) does it with his best mate Al, I do it a bit, on the sly of course, because if I figure if I hug the bloke, I also and by right get to hug the female companions as well. Think about it. One hug with (hopefully) no bumps, gets others with bumps. For some of us, its the only chance we'd get. (deleted...B)

And to think that I was WAS going to visit next time in the "naki. NOT if it involves compulsory manlove.
No lycra in MY wardrobe. I shall do a quick visit to AKL soon and steal me a suit of armour to fend of your advances. so, coming out of the closet? I am old school,yes, some things should just NOT happen and lycra-clad bottom patting man hugs is top of the list.

Never thought Gordon was a sly man hugger, somehow thats just soooo wrong. However, I bet there are a few delighted people to learn of this, explains the long out-of-town trips, mate!!!

[Dace]

You're so old school Bob. Don't you know its OK now to do hugs with blokes? I see blokes hugging all the time on my trips out of Taranaki, (which is a man hug free zone) mostly they're lycra clad cyclists doing it which might explain that other great mystery, of why male cyclists often shave their legs.

But seriously, I think man hugging man is here to stay but should not be done on 4x4 trips or events. Denny Crane (Bill Shatner - Boston legal) does it with his best mate Al, I do it a bit, on the sly of course, because if I figure if I hug the bloke, I also and by right get to hug the female companions as well. Think about it. One hug with (hopefully) no bumps, gets others with bumps. For some of us, its the only chance we'd get. (deleted...B)

And to think that I was WAS going to visit next time in the "naki. NOT if it involves compulsory manlove.
No lycra in MY wardrobe. I shall do a quick visit to AKL soon and steal me a suit of armour to fend of your advances. so, coming out of the closet? I am old school,yes, some things should just NOT happen and lycra-clad bottom patting man hugs is top of the list.

Never thought Gordon was a sly man hugger, somehow thats just soooo wrong. However, I bet there are a few delighted people to learn of this, explains the long out-of-town trips, mate!!!

Reckon ya may be a closet soccer player Gordon

[Jerry]

its ok dace ....we'll remind everyone on the trip this weekend that bob needs a hug ......

[stinky]

The only reason to hug a guy is while looking for his wallet

[wisard2]

The only reason to hug a guy is while looking for his wallet

You look for a lot of wallets do ya stinky??? I'll already have mine out when I come to visit!!

[stinky]

Dont visit that often tho do you

[rangimotors]

The International Council of Manlaws, Ltd.

1. Under no circumstances may two men share an umbrella.

2. It is OK for a man to cry ONLY under the following circumstances:
(a) When a heroic dog dies to save its master.
(b) The moment Angelina Jolie starts unbuttoning her Blouse.
(c) After wrecking your boss's car.
(d) When she is using her teeth.

3. Any Man who brings a camera to a bachelor party may be legally killed and eaten by his buddies.

4. Unless he murdered someone in your family, you must bail a friend out of jail within 12 hours.

5. If you've known a guy for more than 24 hours, his sister is off limits forever unless you actually marry her.

6. Moaning about the brand of free beer in a buddy's fridge is forbidden. However complain at will if the temperature is unsuitable.

7. No man shall ever be required to buy a birthday present for another man.

8. On a road trip, the strongest bladder determines pit stops, not the weakest.

9. When stumbling upon other guys watching a sporting event, you may ask the score of the game in progress, but you may never ask who's playing.

10. You may flatulate in front of a woman only after you have brought her to climax. If you trap her head under the covers for the purpose of flatulent entertainment, she's officially your girlfriend.

11. It is permissible to drink a fruity alcohol drink only when you're sunning on a tropical beach ... And it's delivered by a topless model and only when it's free.

12. Only in situations of moral and/or physical peril are you allowed to kick another guy in the nuts.

13. Unless you're in prison, never fight naked.

14. Friends don't let friends wear Speedos. Ever. Issue closed.

15. If a man's fly is down, that's his problem, you didn't see anything.

16. Women who claim they "love to watch sports" must be treated as spies until they demonstrate knowledge of the game and the ability to drink as much as the other sports watchers.

17. A man in the company of a hot, suggestively dressed woman must remain sober enough to fight.

18. Never hesitate to reach for the last beer or the last slice of pizza, but not both, that's just greedy.

19. If you compliment a guy on his six-pack, you'd better be talking about his choice of beer.

20. Never join your girlfriend or wife in discussing a friend of yours, except if she's withholding sex pending your response.

21. Phrases that may NOT be uttered to another man while lifting weights:
A) Yeah, Baby, Push it!
B) C'mon, give me one more! Harder!
C) Another set and we can hit the showers!

22. Never talk to a man in a bathroom unless you are on equal footing (I.e ., both urinating, both waiting in line, etc.). For all other situations, an almost imperceptible nod is all the conversation you need.

23. Never allow a telephone conversation with a woman to go on longer than you are able to have sex with her. Keep a stopwatch by the phone. Hang up if necessary.

24. The morning after you and a girl who was formerly "just a friend" have carnal, drunken monkey sex, the fact that you're feeling weird and guilty is no reason for you not to nail each other again before the discussion occurs about what a big mistake it was.

25. It is acceptable for you to drive her car. It is not acceptable for her to drive yours.

26. Thou shalt not buy a car in the colours of brown, pink, lime green, orange or sky blue.

27. The girl who replies to the question "What do you want for Christmas?" with "If you loved me, you'd know what I want!" gets an Xbox. End of story.

29. We've all heard about people having guts or balls. But do you really know the difference between them? In an effort to keep you informed, the definition of each is listed below:

"GUTS" is arriving home late after a night out with The guys, being assaulted by your wife with a broom, And having the guts to say, "are you still cleaning or are you flying somewhere?"
"BALLS" is coming home late after a night out with the guys smelling of perfume and beer, lipstick on your collar, slapping your wife on the ass and having the balls to say, "You're next!"

[Moriarty]

The International Council of Manlaws, Ltd.

1. Under no circumsta.............clip...............he guys smelling of perfume and beer, lipstick on your collar, slapping your wife on the ass and having the balls to say, "You're next!"

30. NO manhugs, no excuses, no attempts, a brief handshake after an absence of more than ten years is acceptable.
Barely.
Less than that, a flick of the eyesbrow is all that's needed. NO manhugs.

Efforts to prove how cosmopolitan you are will be rebuffed.

If you fancy a knee in the knackers, try to manhug me.

[wisard2]

The International Council of Manlaws, Ltd.

1. Under no circumsta.............clip...............he guys smelling of perfume and beer, lipstick on your collar, slapping your wife on the ass and having the balls to say, "You're next!"

30. NO manhugs, no excuses, no attempts, a brief handshake after an absence of more than ten years is acceptable.
Barely.
Less than that, a flick of the eyesbrow is all that's needed. NO manhugs.

Efforts to prove how cosmopolitan you are will be rebuffed.

If you fancy a knee in the knackers, try to manhug me.

Now come on Bob, read the topic heading, surely a little manhug would make you happy? You know what they say, Those who are the most vocal in resisting it, are usually the ones who really like it!

[Flash2004]

The International Council of Manlaws, Ltd.

1. Under no circumsta.............clip...............he guys smelling of perfume and beer, lipstick on your collar, slapping your wife on the ass and having the balls to say, "You're next!"

30. NO manhugs, no excuses, no attempts, a brief handshake after an absence of more than ten years is acceptable.
Barely.
Less than that, a flick of the eyesbrow is all that's needed. NO manhugs.

Efforts to prove how cosmopolitan you are will be rebuffed.

If you fancy a knee in the knackers, try to manhug me.

Worryingly, I smell a homophobe. (hates homos, is scared of homos) I think you'd better hug some real bloke at Wainui Bob, (then his Missus, just to be safe) if only to prove your own claim to genuine blokedom. No real bloke is scared of gays or even worries much about them? I even knew one once, drove a stock TJ with 29" wheels.

[Bubba]

I would like to say sorry to the following people;

- To my Mum and Dad, I sorry for being a prick of a kid

- To all the woman that I shagged and made promises I had no intentions of keeping. I’m sorry there weren’t more you

- To all the guys whose feelings I have hurt with my sharp wit and tongue in cheek insults, I'm sorry your mummy raised such a soft arsed wimp, harden up yah pussies.

- To the teacher that picked on me at school and said I would never go anywhere, sorry I run over your cat, I should have had more balls and run you over instead.

- To my mates and comrades that I have lost, sorry my brothers but it was you or me, better it was you
.
- To the mother of my children, sorry I didn’t pull out

- All the readers who have no idea WTF is going on and why a site dedicated to all things outdoors and manly. I’m sorry this once mighty giant of a web site has turned into a daily soap opera, complete with hugging and crying. It’s the internet, you are allowed to be over opinionated, pushy, inflammatory and just plain wrong, it’s your God given right, it’s in the bible, page 216 I think

[Flash2004]

I especially like item #3

Thank you bubba!

[Jerry]

26. Thou shalt not buy a car in the colours of brown, pink, lime green, orange or sky blue.

oops who's gonna tell SKID

[coxsy]

he applied the colour himself and didn't buy it that way so is exempt from rule 26

[Moriarty]

.........clip.........

Worryingly, I smell a homophobe. (hates homos, is scared of homos) I think you'd better hug some real bloke at Wainui Bob, (then his Missus, just to be safe) if only to prove your own claim to genuine blokedom. No real bloke is scared of gays or even worries much about them? I even knew one once, drove a stock TJ with 29" wheels.

Even MORE worryingly, I detect a man who KNOWS the difference between the SMELL of a homophobe and a homomaniac. (if there is such a word and if there isnt, there is now)

I once remarked to Gordon, that Stateside, the drive of choice is a TJ Wrangler..... Sold it, did you Flash? trying to hide, eh? but the truth is OUT there........

See Craig (Genie4x4) for advice on conducting yourself in the company of homos,. he camps (heheheh) with the camps at Vinegar Hill every year.

[Flash2004]

Well said Bob, and a very efficient smokescreen it was too. Next time you're camping with your choice of friend, don't drop the soap or you'll be well korando'd.