Which Bighorn or MU

[mytronic]

Hi all
I am looking to replace my club truck and go Isuzu

Currently looking at 1994 3dr Bighorn irmscher RS 3.2 V6
Are they capable ? Seem to have really bad ramp angle at rear (Fuel tank ,Bumper)
This one has STB Control, no airbags, ABS other than that it has the usuals IFS up front and sprung beam at rear.

Thoughts? I am used to a very capable 3dr Soft top Mitsubishi with Simex ,Winch and factory diff locker. Just worn out and I wouldn't mind a roof to keep my stuff dry

Cheers Mike

[SupraLux]

They are thirsty, but otherwise reliable engine-wise... the auto's can give trouble and are a right bastard (as are the engines) to get out if needed... actually, Isuzu's one major downfall is the way they pack everything in. Awesome when they go, but a bugger to fix.

If fuel costs are an issue, the 3.1TD is probably just as good a powerplant but much cheaper to run (my MU used to get around 30MPG on 36" Simexes).

As for which... its probably going to come down to which you prefer... I think the MU looks better, but the Bighorn has more interior room. Rear diffs are strong as anything, fronts are strong enough. Front MU CV's are smaller than bighorn ones and more prone to breaking when you lift wheels and give it some... a front lokka helps here.

Hope that gives you something to think about

Steve

[dazza85]

They are thirsty, but otherwise reliable engine-wise... the auto's can give trouble and are a right bastard (as are the engines) to get out if needed... actually, Isuzu's one major downfall is the way they pack everything in. Awesome when they go, but a bugger to fix.

XX Snip XX
Steve

Having had the moter out of my '89 Bighorn (I brought it as a dead truck) I would have to agree with them being a pig to get out ... Since the rebuild I have given it a bit of a hiding and overall it has taken it reasonably well

[mytronic]

Thanks guys
I notice that the Alternator is at the bottom of the engine, have any of you put your trucks through rivers etc. We do alot of liquid and mud work. The donkey in this one has done 250000km , no smoke yet and revs nicely.
Yes I like the MU manual but too hard to find one that does not have major oil leaks around the front and rear engine seals
The MU can look quite butch when done right The bighorn has lots of bits that look like they will fall off on its first proper outing

[DaveM]

You can mount a commy alternator up high on the Isuzu's to keep them out of the mud, theres enough room, just need to make a simple bracket up.

I've always preferred the newer shape swb bighorn over the Mu, always wonder whether I should have SAS'd mine and kept it for a hack

[SupraLux]

The alternators are a pig... they have a very bad reputation and it is well deserved (I have changed a couple, so I know... having left much of my own personal DNA in the ones I did). Tight and low, and a poor design that does not last. The commy option would be a good one as they are a high-output design as well. Oh, and the starter motors suffer from the same problems. I'm not sure, but I would imagine the alt and starter would be more reliable if it wasn't for their location (And the starter needs some imaginatively created spanners, 3 arms and a few hours to get out )

There is not a lot on the Bighorn that will fall off - and the later model RS ones (same shape as Daves above) are a pretty solid design externally. I like them, but I like the MU more - especially with a solid axle in the front and 36" simexes

Steve

[flyingbrick]

Just wondering why you would narrow it down to isuzu?

[mytronic]

Just wondering why you would narrow it down to isuzu?

Yes , well , hmmmmm
I am having trouble finding a cheap reliable unit to replace my JTop. I LOVE my mitz but it has no roof at the back and am sick of getting cold and damp. The cab is enclosed, but still a roof , luxury
Not to incur the raft of why nots, but I don't like toyotas in any way shape or form, yes they are reliable. Would kill a Suzuki if not roll it ! Might replace with Mits Hardtop version but was thinking what else is out there. Have had a Cherokee and if it was not for the fuel consumption I would get another. Cant afford my dream machine (Jeep Wrangler) So, started on the MU hunt, but after testing 6, all have oil leaks, seems common Oh, and I want short wheel base.

Seems that the Bighorn is not for me either aye lads, too hard to fix out on the track Will keep on looking

Cheers mike

[Swamped]

Not keen on a patrol either then?? Easy to pick em up de reg and just A frame em. Same with a zuk. You might roll a zuk if your not careful but isn't that applicable to all trucks??

[flyingbrick]

What about a SWB safari?

Mines stock auto 1990 and is incredibly capable and great aftermarket support which the bighorn seems to be lacking in comparison. I'm not sure what the mu and bighorn gets but the safari's seem to come with either LSD or rear locker and its awesome

fuel economy is great imo considering its 4.2 litre.

[mytronic]

Yeah, looked at those. We have one in the club. Really heavy are they not? Poor turning circle
Yes they go all places, they seem to be well priced 7k odd, need 2k spent on them without tires. It was interesting watching a stock standard go from nerd to stud

M

[flyingbrick]

no way.

these days you can pic one up for about 4k.

If you are wanting to get one for off road use don't go buying a real mint one imo.

[Swamped]

If its not gotta be road legal u'll get one for under 2k and run an A frame. And yes to both...Real heavy, turning circle resembling a 747 and quite wide but i still like mine.

[flyingbrick]

If its not gotta be road legal u'll get one for under 2k and run an A frame. And yes to both...Real heavy, turning circle resembling a 747 and quite wide but i still like mine.

they arent THAT bad. its no honda civic but its never tried to be.

[mytronic]

Hold on
safari not an isuzu
But I see what we are getting at, has given me some thought on I vrs S (Safari)
Never really tought about that

Back on topic though
What bad habbits does a MU have then ?
Alternator, starter etc
Better than a Mitsubishi 3dr ? Same capabilities ?

Cheers M

[mytronic]

On that note
94 MU

How to tell if LSD or Open
Are they all LSD from that error ?

Thanks

[mudgripz]

The 3.2 V6 and 3.1 could do ok, but if I were you I'd take a look at another isuzu - the 87-92 bighorn with the 2.8T motor. This is one of the best diesels out of japan, and all round a tough, reliable and durable unit. Have had a couple of this model well modified for club purposes and have done hundreds of offroad tracks, and 150,000 in them, and they are an excellent truck. Have heavier cvs than some later models, good sturdy gearboxes and drivetrain, are very easy to tune to big hp. Good selection of lockers both air and auto available for front and rear. Easy to lift and develop for offroad. Not easy to break stuff on this model - though you will break a cv or two learning to use front lockers - they take a bit of practice to get right.

The 87-92 swb is actually a mid wheelbase with alot of room behind the rear seat and from years of club experience can be made to perform very well. Also not hard to get them articulating well - my last one ranked 5th of 25 club trucks on a club ramp index night - well ahead of alot of toyotas and the odd safari - also a good reliable unit.

Isuzu 2.8T best of the isuzu motors - with no particular weaknesses apart from needing a cheap breather kit now and then. The 3.1 can also also do huge ks.

From alot of club experience with isuzus I'd take a good look at one of this model. Can still find the odd lower mileage one at good price. With thoughtful development you can get a helluva lot of bang for your buck. Easy to build a tough, well performing truck with surprising level of offroad capability.

[mytronic]

Thanks for the detailed email ,most informative
Have been looking at the 93 3.2 V6 RS, Its ramp is really bad at the back though.
I notice Breather Kit comes up on forums but have not managed to google a fitment guide let alone a kit. What is it
I looked at the 92 Bighorn but found it a bit unstable on a sideling (We do lots of that) so got put off. Hence my MU track, lower ,sportier and good power to weight ratio for a 3.1
I am looking at a a 94 MU where the turbo has been replaced with a 2.8 Turbo and then the diagram punctured to allow more boost ??? + Intercooler. Don't know if it has LSD or Open diff. Seems the MU and Bighorns cock a leg or two lots. Any mods? 50mm shackles and cut the bump stops up front ?

[DaveM]

Most of the diesel Isuzu's suffered from pressurised sumps, the breather kits made a big improvement to this

[mytronic]

Do you have any details or web site info
So I do some research and perhaps source one

[DaveM]

Can't find the details now, but the guy in ChCh that made them used to sell them on Trade Me, might be worth a check on there, or the clubisuzu site

[mudgripz]

Fitted a breather kit from the chch guy on my first 2.8 at $250ish. Worked well - and ended 1-2 odd oil leaks. On next truck got a simple one, a "Monza catch can" from trade me car parts listing for $40 on special, normally $70. Bit of extra hose for connection from back of block, plus a screw in nipple into bottom of can and hose down to dipstick tube and all great for about $60. Easy job to fit and works just as well. No leaks.

Would not worry about bighorn being unstable on sidlings. Have given my ones heaps, testing them out on steep sidings and never had a problem - about the same in this respect as any other club truck. The more you lift the more often this is an issue of course, as with any truck, but with fatter feet you mitigate this to a fair extent.

For all isuzu maintenance and development questions go to http://www.clubisuzu.com, register, go to 'forum', and you've got all you need you know on isuzus. Excellent site - mostly for NZ/aussies but members from all round the world.

[SupraLux]

All vehicles have bad habits - I figure the best thing to do is pick the one you like and make it capable and reliable. All the main MU bad points have been covered. Weakish CV's, shit alternator, hard to get the engines in and out. All things that can be overcome (solid axle and commy V6 ).

Steve

[mudgripz]

Heading towards 10 years club offroading with the bighorns now, which is time enough to know them backwards - strengths, weaknesses, performance capability etc.

Motors not as easy to get out as roomier cruisers etc but still ok. Helped take one out recently and no issues. It would certainly help to have forearms about the thickness of a chopstick... Re cvs its a matter of picking the trucks with the heavier shafts, and then learning to use the front lokkas properly - simple but learnable and saves alot of bother. You sold me the aussie lokka on my last truck Steve. Went very well - good product. Alternator fair, but if you do plan alot of bogholing then best repositioned.

In all 2.8 a damn good truck and alot of guys who buy and develop them tend to keep them for a long time. Motor, drivetrain, turbo and box etc all good - and heaps of spares available for not much $$. Was happy to get another and this one will be a keeper.

Is the 3.2 derived from a honda legend?

[SupraLux]

I don't think so Mike - I'm pretty sure they are different motors altogether... but I could be wrong.

The ramp angle at the back of a Bighorn is no drama - remove the towbar, body lift it 2" and lift the tank to match... also you can 'trim' the rear lower quarters of the bodywork to avoid damaging it.

As Mike said - the 2.8TD is an awesome little powerplant - getting dated now, but good. As for the 2.8T in the 3.1 - thats common since the 3.1 turbo is non-rebuildable and they seem to fail around 130,000km. New ones are very expensive, so guys tend to bolt on the rebuildable and reliable 2.8 turbos. I'd be very cautious about a motor where the diaphragm has been punctured to allow more boost (if I read that right)... sounds like a backyard powerboost mod - overboosting a turbo diesel can have serious consequences... I'd have it checked by a reputable diesel shop before buying something like that.

Keep us posted

[mudgripz]

Apparently there's a fairly new isuzu 4wd motor - not the touchy 4JX1 - and its the old 2.8 4jb1T bored/stroked out etc to 3.0 litres. Don't know its code but if its indeed an update of the 2.8 it could be a good option soon if they haven't electroniced the hell out of it.

James and I did a 2" body and 2" suspension lift on my latest 88 lwb - it has a few bits from your old isuzu steve incl bits of its bigbore....a few more to come no doubt

[mytronic]

Thanks guys
very informative. It seems people that own an Isuzu love em and people who dont hate them. My mechnic advised me not to buy any Isuzu diesel period
But with that taken under advisement and taking all postings from here and clubisuzu I have purchased a 1994 3.1D MU for $3700 as listed on this site forsale. I wanted a SWB which is what swayed me this way. Will get the Turbo fixed, fit breather and perhaps order a Front Ozi Locker (emailing indapendent4x as we speak) Thought about air shocks up front ? No doubt you will hear more from me after my first club run and the ribbing I will get from our members who all own Toyotas, Zuks and one Safari SWB. Interesting times ahead. If you have any other Mods I would be greatly appreciative. Retro V6 and SAS out of budget at moment

Thanks
Mike

[mudgripz]

Connect in with the clubisuzu website and you'll find everything you want to know.

As you noted, people who own the isuzus love themand keep them for a long time, and people who don't know them sometimes talk them down. Bit of wisdom here - the isuzu owners are speaking from experience while the others ain't - its just talk which people spout on all subjects - 4x4s, rifles, you name it. Worth very little.

There's an old saying: " a man with an experience is not at the mercy of a man with just an opinion. "

Re lockers, there is an option for a rear air locker at cost price for isuzu owners. Its a chinese one and have been testing it for several months in my truck. Runs very well, not much dearer than an auto locker but more sound option with it in the back.

Have one more trip to do this sunday to test it and will then be doing a report on this site. So far 100%.

[mytronic]

Re lockers, there is an option for a rear air locker at cost price for isuzu owners. Its a chinese one and have been testing it for several months in my truck. Runs very well, not much dearer than an auto locker but more sound option with it in the back.

Cool, let me know when and where ,I am interested

Yes, it's hard to find a non-isuzu owner that has nice stuff to say. But I found the same with my JTop Mitz. I love my Mitz and it is in getting fixed as we speak. I will be sad to see it go ,but comfort while bouncing around off track will be nice in winter. Perhaps I will list it on ORE as this model with factory diff lock is sort after, even just for parts

Thanks for everyones input. I take delivery tonight at 11pm . I feel like a boy with a new toy

[mudgripz]

OK mytronic - give me a call tomorrow evening if poss 03 322 4570 chch and will give you details re the airlocker.

Mike