Bleeding the clutch..

Cloggy_NZ · Post by **Cloggy_NZ** » Sat Jul 15, 2006 8:45 pm

Having a few issues with the clutch on my Disco. There doesn't seem to be enough travel in the slave cylinder department to fully release the clutch. I can not select reverse gear without it crashing into gear. Selecting any forward gears is also difficult. The car moves of as soon as the clutch pedal comes of the floor. Have bled the hydraulic system several times without any improvement.
Does anybody else have a similar problem??
Replaced everything to do with the clutch 15000km ago. Noticed then that the plastic bit between the clutch fork and release bearing had significant wear and replaced that with a new piece as well. Just wondering if this particular part is causing problems again. Don't fancy pulling the gearbox out again, what a mission

H2OLOVA · Post by **H2OLOVA** » Sat Jul 15, 2006 11:36 pm

haven't got a hose thats swelling up under pressure? Just a wild guess.

JTop · Post by **JTop** » Sun Jul 16, 2006 12:10 am

have you got wear at the pedal pivot? there is usually an adj on the pedal pushrod to increase M/C travel relative to pedal travel, leave some freeplay to prevent slipping
J Top

albundy · Post by **albundy** » Sun Jul 16, 2006 7:17 am

You don't have mud and small stcks getting into the bell housng. It gets inbetween the fingers in pressure plate. Happened to mne.
Al

Cloggy_NZ · Post by **Cloggy_NZ** » Sun Jul 16, 2006 9:33 am

H2OLOVA wrote:haven't got a hose thats swelling up under pressure? Just a wild guess.

Good thinking, I hadn't thought of that. But been out and had a look. The hose is only very short, and no it is not swelling. Damn, wish it could have been that easy.

JTop wrote:have you got wear at the pedal pivot? there is usually an adj on the pedal pushrod to increase M/C travel relative to pedal travel, leave some freeplay to prevent slipping
J Top

When I replaced the clutch last time I repaired the bush in the pedal (made a new one). There is a cam type bolt in the pedal which you can turn to set the height of the pedal. I have got this set a max. height to get the most travel out of the pedal. The actual pushrod from slave cylinder to clutchfork is non-adjustable. It is a fixed length piece of rod. So no joy in this department either.

albundy wrote:You don't have mud and small stcks getting into the bell housng. It gets inbetween the fingers in pressure plate. Happened to mne.
Al

I hope not. Being a Land Rover the bellhousing is pretty well sealed. Supposed to be waterproof if you fit the wading plug (which I don't). So I suppose there is a small chance there could be dirt of some sort in there. Only way to find out is to pull the gearbox. And that is a major job in these things. They are so big and heavy most people recommend pulling the engine instead if you want to replace the clutch.

Thanks for the advice guys. It is very much appreciated. I am so hoping it is something simple. The odd thing is the missus drove it without any problems. She drives it quite a bit and would notice a change in the pedal (at the moment is goes almost half way down before giving any resistance). I hop in the car the next day to go to work and notice immediately there is something wrong with the clutch. It feels like there is lots of air in the line. But I have tried every method of bleeding there is, no joy. Have had both slave and mastercylinders apart. All looks OK. But I gues looks could be deceiving. I am at the point of just buying new slave and mastercylinders again in the hope this might cure it. Anything to prevent pulling the gearbox out again :cry:

H2OLOVA · Post by **H2OLOVA** » Sun Jul 16, 2006 9:46 am

Hate to say it but would it be worth talking to either a clutch shop or Disco dealer. There might be a simple little trick that will solve all your problems :lol:

or it could be a waste of time but at this stage you have nothing to loose! Do you?

Rangielux · Post by **Rangielux** » Sun Jul 16, 2006 1:50 pm

Cloggy, if you can't see anything wrong with the master or slave cyls. then unfortunatly it probably is something in the bell housing then

What would you do if you were in the back of beyond or ...... say Te Kuiti ? This - make up a longer rod from the slave to the clutch fork by about 10mm and see how that feels. Just make sure it doesn't make the clutch slip

Cloggy_NZ · Post by **Cloggy_NZ** » Sun Jul 16, 2006 3:35 pm

Rangielux wrote:This - make up a longer rod from the slave to the clutch fork by about 10mm and see how that feels. Just make sure it doesn't make the clutch slip

I made one of those today in the hope it would make a difference. It didn't which is understandable as the hydraulic set up is self adjusting and making a longer pushrod is like putting in a new clutchplate. But what it has achieved is pushing the piston further into the slave cylinder. It was uncomfortably close to popping out the end judging by the wear marks inside the slave cylinder bore. This is the same (piston close to popping out) on my Disco and the Range Rover engine and box which I have in my Series 1.

Rangielux · Post by **Rangielux** » Sun Jul 16, 2006 8:08 pm

So any better idea of whats going on now :?:

RoloverRover · Post by **RoloverRover** » Mon Jul 17, 2006 1:54 am

I just swaped the enigine in my series3 and had a similar experience with the clutch and was praying to god i didnt need to pull the engine out again as it is the easiest way into those damn things and mine is an ld28 (heavy) not a fun thing to do. But after a while i noticed it was getting very hard to push it at all to the point it locked solid. I lost my patience and stabbed the peddle down as hard as i could it came free with a hell of a bang and felt fine after that till about 20min latter when it started to get very soft underfoot then no clutch at all. I got home and checked the reserve found it had lost all fluid so i topped it up and pumped the fluid thru and still had no clutch feeling had a look under the bonnet anf found nothing. After about an hour i did notice 1 of the rubber lines looked wet so i pulled it off. What had happend was the rubber inner had perished and split and a peice of the rubber had logged in the line blocking it and the fluid was travelling between the inner and outer lineings seeping out at the lowest point. Was wondering if you are using any fluid?

RoloverRover · Post by **RoloverRover** » Thu Jul 20, 2006 5:59 pm

did you find/fix the problem?

Cloggy_NZ · Post by **Cloggy_NZ** » Thu Jul 20, 2006 6:27 pm

No haven't found the problem yet.
I have fitted another (second hand) slave cylinder, made a longer push rod, bled the whole system yet again and now have it at a driveable point. Just don't select reverse in front of a crowd, it's embarrasing (change them, don't rearrange them

). The noise of crunching gears is terrible.
After driving it for a couple of days it does seem a little better. Maybe there is dirt stuck in which has dislodged. If that is the case it should fix itself in the weekend when it will get another good thrashing.
I do suspect the master cylinder as well though. The seals rely on pressure to seal properly. If they are worn and don't seal as well as they should then perhaps in that first little bit of travel enough fluid can bypass the seal before it swells under the pressure and makes a proper seal. Would explain the soft / free travel initially in the pedal.
There is no loss of fluid.
To be continued........