PTO winch probs

[Twodiffs]

Hey guys...I'm trying to help out a Patrol owner.
They have fitted a factory pto to their GQ and have some issues, can you have a squizz at the link and maybe help out please?

http://www.patrol4x4.com/forum/nissan-p ... ase-58588/

I've fitted 2 pto's to my Nissans but never had any probs so it's beyond me. Also more Nissans in NZ with winches etc.

Cheers fellas

Jamie.

[meece4x4]

mine rumbles a little under extreme load (like pulling sleepy Bighorns out of ditches ) but thats because I have a little play in the shafts.

mine dosnt rumble in neutral or under light load, so yeah Im as much help as a chocolate teacup

[Fakey]

Not familiar with the patrol set up, but is there any back lash between the pto gear an the drive gear form the gearbox? If there is not enough they may have to fit a thicker gasket between the pto an gbox. (or just fit a gasket instead of the silicone they prob used

[shantillylais]

thanks for posting that Jamie (2diffs). I have joined up so I can research and see replies easier. so here is my original post from Patrol4x4.com forum.
*****Recently I fitted a PTO unit on the gearbox of my 4.2td manual, the standard Nissan one, and winch. It bolted up easily, and without any strain or difficulty. The control cable moves the lever easily, and the forward and reverse selection is easy.
Prior to fitting it, the gearbox had all the usual or normal noises, and gear changes were easy and good.
However, since fitting it, in NUETRAL, I now have a "rumble" similar to a front gearbox bearing, that goes away when the clutch is depressed. This is most noticeable in the morning when the car is cold.

NOTE, this is NOT a shaft/universal or winch noise, and I am not attempting to engage the PTO.

The noise appears to go away after the gearbox warms up.
It was not there prior to fitting the pto, so assume it is the pto making the noise, or the meshing of the gears.
Also, the gearbox now is harder to get into 1st, but especially 2nd when the car is cold, eg first thing in the morning.
I am using new Nulon 80/90 gearbox oil and nulon additive, both were used in the gearbox before.
BOTH the noise and the gear shifting are ok when the car is warm, eg after about 25km of driving.

Are these noises/shifting typical or normal of this system and something not to worry about?
(For those that dont know, the pto runs off the input side of the gearbox.)
I would like to get information before having to dismantle the exhaust again to get the PTO off again.

Over to those who have Nissan PTO knowledge?

replies to date:
Fakey, as far as I know there was backlash, the guy (diesel mechanic) who checked my work, did so when I test fitted it, then suggested a second 0.3mm gasket, and double checked it before final tensioning of the 6 bolts. He also checked the movement of the drive shaft by hand after fitting it to the PTO, then after fitting the sheer pin to the winch. All moved effortlessly, and freely.

EdC thanks for that input, I am aware of the copper strip test (the winch has bronze gears, and oil has to comply), but wasnt aware that the Nulon oil did not comply. I will have to check that.

__________________
GQ LWB td42turbo, intercooler, 3" stainless exhaust, 2" lift, airbags, rooftop tent, winch bar, pto winch, drawer and storage system, LR tanks. secretary Wattle Rangers 4wd Club (SA). *****

[shantillylais]

just found this, so today its my first port of call, change the oil!!

QUESTIONS & ANSWERS
QQ I recently changed the oil in my gearbox and now my gears grate when
changing. Why is this?
AA Incorrect gear oil selection or the viscosity is too high, or the performance spec is incorrect. For
example, if API GL-4 is specified and you have used API GL-5 this problem can occur. To overcome this
problem you need to change to the correct viscosity/performance spec lubricant.
QQ Why do I have diff iculty changing from 1st to 2nd gear when my car is cold?
AA This very common complaint is due to the fact that, when cold, the viscosity of the lubricant is high
(thick) and this creates drag which affects the operation of the synchro rings. As the oil warms up the
problem disappears. Check to make sure you are using the correct grade and viscosity lubricant.

[Twodiffs]

Castrol vmx80 is the go for gearbox oil.

[4WDbits]

...Recently I fitted a PTO unit on the gearbox of my 4.2td manual, the standard Nissan one, and winch. It bolted up easily, and without any strain or difficulty. The control cable moves the lever easily, and the forward and reverse selection is easy.
Prior to fitting it, the gearbox had all the usual or normal noises, and gear changes were easy and good.
However, since fitting it, in NUETRAL, I now have a "rumble" similar to a front gearbox bearing, that goes away when the clutch is depressed. This is most noticeable in the morning when the car is cold......

The PTO drive runs off the 4th gear cog on the idler/lay shaft so the first gear (or 2) are always rotating unless the clutch is depressed. The gear selection on the PTO drive engages the PTO output in whichever direction.
Check that the noise goes away with the PTO drive removed
Cheak the state of the input gear and bearing in the PTO drive.

[charo249]

My truck came with the factory PTO and doesn't rumble in neutral, did used to be a bit rough on the 1st to 2nd change however oil change fixed that. Presume you have checked this, but is oil level good - I always fill mine to it starts coming out the filler hole (which is a lot more oil than the workshop manual states)

[shantillylais]

well, I changed the oil from api gl5 to api gl4, (and yes it takes more than the manual says probably because of the PTO unit), and now the gear changes are fine. The noise is a little quieter, but still there. So sometime soon, I guess I have to take off the PTO unit and see if the noise goes away. Bit of a pain really, because have to dismantle the exhaust to access it. My gut feeling is that the noise will disappear, because there wasnt a noise before fitting the PTO drive.

[albundy]

Bit of a pain really, because have to dismantle the exhaust to access it

The exhausts are pretty easy to take off and bolt back on. I did iot last week in under half an hour complete exhaust.
Al

[shantillylais]

lol, hardyakka, mine is a custom built mandrel bent 3" stainless from the turbo dump, and not only is it tight fit, 10mm clearance, its welded...... I didnt find out that they didnt put a flange where it was supposed to be until this problem arose.

[shantillylais]

sorry, that last post was for albundy.
still havent had time to have the exhaust removed ( I cant cut 75mm stainless), so I can get the pto off again. The guy I bought it off just replied to the other forum, and said it did same in his swb, and thought it was normal.

[Pedro]

check the bearings in the pto while you have it out, give them a good clean and spin them, any noise they are poked, i would guess they are a deep groove ball bearing type, replace them anyway

Pedro