Winch problems

[nstacey]

I spotted a bit of damage on my steel winch rope today so figured I'd wind it out and have a look at it. I winched it in and out a couple of metres under power to make sure it was all working then pulled the whole rope out under freespool. Now it won't winch back in. The solenoid just clicks and nothing happens.

When I put a multimeter over any of the four of the points they have ~13V at them when I press either the winch in or out button. Is this what's meant to happen? any suggestions?



Also this is what my winch rope looks like around 3 metres from the end, do I need to worry about this?



Its a Runva GEW9000

[Jerry]

Sounds like your solenoids .... my 8074 is doing the same thing

[NJV6]

I reckon it sounds like the solinoids are working fine...

Run a jumper cable from the single post the the end of the motor (A) to F1 and another jumper from F2 to +ve on the battery and see if the motor works.

And the rope - with a kink like that just wind it on tight and it'll pull back to its normal shape.

[nstacey]

I reckon it sounds like the solinoids are working fine...

Run a jumper cable from the single post the the end of the motor (A) to F1 and another jumper from F2 to +ve on the battery and see if the motor works.

And the rope - with a kink like that just wind it on tight and it'll pull back to its normal shape.

Maybe I should have read this a bit better before I started...

I pulled the solenoid apart and everything seemed ok inside, no water or dirt ingress and both switches inside work.

I tried the winch with 3 jumper cables, one to the earth, then +ve to the other two, one to the red or yellow terminal the other to the blue. But got nothing, NJV6, is what your saying is it should be say connect the blue to the red terminal then yellow to the battery? It was completely dead with what I was trying didn't even get a spark.

I pulled it out and apart, if nothing else I got to see inside it...







My Dad reckons its down to just corrosion on the terminals on the outside of the winch, they've been cleaned up a bit in these pics. I'm not convinced. Anyone see any other issues with it? Also, is there an easy way to get those brushes back in when reassembling?

[meatc]

the end cap should come off the main motor body, put the armature back in the the brushes around it and end cap back on.

Have you checked the brake in the drum? Motor may have been trying to turn but unable to due to the brake packing a sad.

When you jumped the motor you should have an earth to the housing, a positive to the single post at the end of the motor and then positive to either of the two posts near the front, not both at the same time. They should be marked A and F1 and F2. Connect positive to A and the positive to F1 or F2. Motor looks pretty clean and unused so doubt there is an issue there though.

[nstacey]

When you jumped the motor you should have an earth to the housing, a positive to the single post at the end of the motor and then positive to either of the two posts near the front, not both at the same time. They should be marked A and F1 and F2. Connect positive to A and the positive to F1 or F2. Motor looks pretty clean and unused so doubt there is an issue there though.

Cool, this is what I was doing. It was very tough to move the drum on freespool just by hand, If the brake was the issue will it have damaged the motor? I had no motor noise at all, just a clicking solenoid.

[kbushnz]

Tip: Don't use wet and dry paper to clean up the copper commutator on the motor. (The bit the brushes run on) The abrasive grit on wet-and-dry is silicon carbide and is electrically conductive. Any residue lodged in the gap between the commutator bars can cause problems / short it out. Should use garnet or crocus paper.

Calvin

[andrew007]

hi m8,have been down this rd b4,with starter mtr,similar to winch.both drawing high current & operated by soleniod.
have you had your battery load tested by auto sparky?
mine was the same as yours,12 volts,as soon as decent load applied,volts dropped away,crook batt cell.

[pjb]

I reckon one of those stator coils has fused.

Before you put it back together, test the resistance of each of those coils on the housing. Especially the bottom one which tends to get wet (I can see rust).

When there's water in there the coil can arc over to ground and this erodes the copper coil, eventually it becomes thin then heats up and fuses. All this can happen under the tape that's wrapping the coil, so hard to see unless you poke around. This is how my last winch died.

[kbjj]

I've had the armature windings solder joints to the comutator bars let go, causing your symptoms. I had to re-crimp them. I use those green scotchbrites to clean comutators, but as kbushnz said, dont use wet'n'dry. Re read how njv6 told you to connect motor, just make sure motor case has a good earth.
Stick a drain bung in motor while you have it apart, looks nice and clean at moment, but they get crap in them as they are hard to waterproof.
Jeremy

[NJV6]

I had a good reply written and lost it so now is the brief version!!!

This is how you wire up the winch motor you have. To change direction of the motor simply swap the 'B' and 'C' around - so you put power in "c" and join 'B' to 'A'.



I just use jumper cables whenever I have bench tested mine.

Glen

[kbushnz]

I fully sealed my winch motor and drilled and tapped for a breather hose. So when its hot and gets wet, doesn't suck in water...
Never found any signs of water in it to date.

Calvin

[3VILC]

Got mine in bits now.. looks about a similar state to the pics above.
Tested the coils all have close to zero resistance end to end, and none are shorted to earth, brushes all look ok and everythings fairly cleaned up now. Just one of the bus bars on the outside of the brush holder appears to have shorted to the rivet that holds the brush in..see photo in my post "winch wont wind under load".. seems strange as the rivet is for the same terminal to which the bus bar feeds but the plastic insulator around the terminal is melted and the bus bar appears to be warped slightly out of shape. This is the only things that looks like it could be causing any problems

[nstacey]

Got mine in bits now.. looks about a similar state to the pics above.
Tested the coils all have close to zero resistance end to end, and none are shorted to earth, brushes all look ok and everythings fairly cleaned up now. Just one of the bus bars on the outside of the brush holder appears to have shorted to the rivet that holds the brush in..see photo in my post "winch wont wind under load".. seems strange as the rivet is for the same terminal to which the bus bar feeds but the plastic insulator around the terminal is melted and the bus bar appears to be warped slightly out of shape. This is the only things that looks like it could be causing any problems

I haven't looked at mine for a few weeks now. But yeah I sent some more pics to another member and he spotted the same thing you have described. One of my insulators had melted around the rivet. So that looks like the likely cause.. Haven't worked out the fix yet...

[3VILC]

Got mine in bits now.. looks about a similar state to the pics above.
Tested the coils all have close to zero resistance end to end, and none are shorted to earth, brushes all look ok and everythings fairly cleaned up now. Just one of the bus bars on the outside of the brush holder appears to have shorted to the rivet that holds the brush in..see photo in my post "winch wont wind under load".. seems strange as the rivet is for the same terminal to which the bus bar feeds but the plastic insulator around the terminal is melted and the bus bar appears to be warped slightly out of shape. This is the only things that looks like it could be causing any problems

I haven't looked at mine for a few weeks now. But yeah I sent some more pics to another member and he spotted the same thing you have described. One of my insulators had melted around the rivet. So that looks like the likely cause.. Haven't worked out the fix yet...

Yeah that bus bar is pretty bloody close to some of those rivets, considering the fair whack of current thats running through it, wouldn't take much to jump across with a bit of moisture in there. Best fix i can see is to bend the bar away as much as possible and wrap some electrical tape around it. And if yours is like mine its the rivet thats closest to the bottom of the motor. ie. right where a puddle would sit. Sounds like we might have the same problem.. hopefully a simple fix

[nstacey]

This is the melted rivet, bottom right. So you reckon wrap the bar in tape to stop it arcing across... Does the plastic isolator itself need replacing?

[3VILC]

Yup same problem as mine by the looks, different rivet tho, maybe why mine winches a little and yours not at all. Of course the crap solder joints on the ends of the bar may not help at all, appears to be little more than a blob on the top edge of the bar/terminal

Well you can successfully coax the bar so you have about 1mm clearance to the rivets. except now the solder joint has cracked off. Looks like a fairly crap solder job anyway thinking maybe the tiny hole n bolt idea might be easier than trying to resolder

Id say the insulator would be okay as the rivet hasnt dropped down to touch the casing.

[3VILC]

Looking at your pic again that explains it.. yours appears to have shorted to the earthed side (as the tiny gap is easier than going through the motor windings, path of least resistance), thus doesnt spin at all.. mine is to the same terminal the bar is powering, so wondering if this solder joint that cracked has always been shit thus the power has decided to jump the tiny gap through the rivet so motor turns but not under load

[nstacey]

3VILC, how did your repairs go? tried a fix like you suggested but no progress... I will get round to talking to an auto sparky some day...

[3VILC]

nstacey, cleaned all mine up, put some tiny bolts thru the terminals for strength and resoldered them, all back together but have yet to put it back on my truck. Have to get a new battery first think my main problem is one battery is on the way out so not getting much voltage under load causing more current draw instead. Fingers crossed the guts of the motor are ok. Has been a good winch until that day