lifts laws to be inforced

[muddyhilux]

The club caption will only be signing the Authority card to say that you have been part of NZFWDA for 1 year or more, and that you are a fit and proper person to hold an authority card.nothing more

This just got sneaked in the mix!!!!
No it didnt, it has always been intended that this would be part of the requirements.

this is my biggest concern,as stated a lot of guys have big lifted trucks and have driven them carefully for years but not joined a club,surely we should not have to park up our trucks for a year (many use them for work purposes) until someone says we use them for what they're intended to be used for

[monstr]

So I am a bit slow and still cant get this,if you have a cert for a body lift why do we need a card from a club or why do we need any thing more than the cert plate that states the lift.

To prove that the vehicle is used for its intended purpose IE offroad driving. It's to stop boyracers who lift the crap out of 4wd's so they look cool. these sort of people wont join a 4wd club so there vehicles wont get a warrent and can't cause harm when driven by muppets on the road.

Does that make sense now?

I'ts the same as having to prove you do motorsport events if you have a cage in your street/race car. If your not racing you
don't need a cage do you!

Still cant see them moving the goal posts once the game has started ,Surely if your road legal now then once these new regs come into force you must still be legal ", if not there is going to be a lot of very pi##ed of punters my self included ,I have had to cert my truck twice at a cost of nearly $1000 ,are they going to refund if i dont stay in a club?

[DaveM]

From what Tony has said, the rule will be Retrospective. If you have a cert now, you are fine. If you need to cert or re-cert in the future, these new laws will apply.

[muddyhilux]

From what Tony has said, the rule will be Retrospective. If you have a cert now, you are fine. If you need to cert or re-cert in the future, these new laws will apply.

that's half the problem though,just cert their trucks,and then mod more and need to re-cert,my next cert will be my forth,simply because i cant afford to do all mods at once and i'm not going to drive my truck illegally

[monstr]

From what Tony has said, the rule will be Retrospective. If you have a cert now, you are fine. If you need to cert or re-cert in the future, these new laws will apply.

Ha thats just doubled the value of my truck" (Anyone want to buy a cert plate) comes with a freetruck.

[DaveM]

From what Tony has said, the rule will be Retrospective. If you have a cert now, you are fine. If you need to cert or re-cert in the future, these new laws will apply.

that's half the problem though,just cert their trucks,and then mod more and need to re-cert,my next cert will be my forth,simply because i cant afford to do all mods at once and i'm not going to drive my truck illegally

Would be nice if they came up with a better system, rather than charging $400 a pop.
Perhaps if the NZ4WDA could "negotiate" a lower fee for multiple certs on vehicles, people would see this as a cause worth giving their support?

[tallsam66]

From what Tony has said, the rule will be Retrospective. If you have a cert now, you are fine. If you need to cert or re-cert in the future, these new laws will apply.

that's half the problem though,just cert their trucks,and then mod more and need to re-cert,my next cert will be my forth,simply because i cant afford to do all mods at once and i'm not going to drive my truck illegally

Would be nice if they came up with a better system, rather than charging $400 a pop.
Perhaps if the NZ4WDA could "negotiate" a lower fee for multiple certs on vehicles, people would see this as a cause worth giving their support?

The reason the certs are so expensive is they are done by a monopoly ....they have all fixed there prices to be basically the same.Any organisation run by Tony Johnson is an organisation im keeping well away.

[rangimotors]

Muddey1 you have not come on here to ask our opinion, you have decided what is going to happen/control us and decided to defend it. Doesn't matter what anyone says you will not change your mind as to what you put forward.

You wonder why everyone doesnt want to become a member of your assn.
I would rather get a fine a day than have a man like you represent me (rule me) and tell me what i can and can't do. I have done before but I will never again pay any money to your assn.

Enjoy life attempting to rule the roost..

[DieselBoy]

Muddey1 you have not come on here to ask our opinion, you have decided what is going to happen/control us and decided to defend it. Doesn't matter what anyone says you will not change your mind as to what you put forward.

You wonder why everyone doesnt want to become a member of your assn.
I would rather get a fine a day than have a man like you represent me (rule me) and tell me what i can and can't do. I have done before but I will never again pay any money to your assn.

Enjoy life attempting to rule the roost..

^^^^^^ Like ^^^^^^^^

[mikee]

^^^^^^ ^^^^^^

[rowinz]

Has there been any discussion about limits of liability for the 'club captain' when issuing a card?
I am fairly sure that unless it is very clearly defined then there will be a sudden lack of nominees for club captain positions.

Will the club require indemnity insurance? What about training/experience requirements for card issuer?
(same thing happens at work places with permit issuers running a mile rathan sign a permit - cos they then take responsibilty).

There is a whole nother level of complexity to this that doesn't seem to have been raised (it may have been mentioned but my eyes glazed after many pages).


For what its worth, as I see it, the current LVV rules are pretty clear - they just need enforcing more rigidly (and perhaps a slight change to capture >50mm susp lift correctly).
Cheers
Rowan

[coxsy]

bloodly hell he's not in a position to tell you what to do,
ffs they are trying to save the situation, not profit from it,
LT are pushing, they are trying to reduce the effect on us all,a world of independent kiwi males, no one tell me what to do,got us to where we are and can help us fall , please see the differance

[DieselBoy]

I notice the Certification Threshold document has been taken down from the LVVTA web site:

http://www.lvvta.org.nz/CertThresholdSc ... il04V3.pdf

Thats odd, I wonder if its because they are re-writing the rules

[J_Dub]

bloodly hell he's not in a position to tell you what to do,
ffs they are trying to save the situation, not profit from it,
LT are pushing, they are trying to reduce the effect on us all,a world of independent kiwi males, no one tell me what to do,got us to where we are and can help us fall , please see the differance

exactly..

but some just seem to think theres some conspiracy behind everything...

I no stress.. its just not that complicated

[crazyclark31]

Muddey1 you have not come on here to ask our opinion, you have decided what is going to happen/control us and decided to defend it. Doesn't matter what anyone says you will not change your mind as to what you put forward.

You wonder why everyone doesnt want to become a member of your assn.
I would rather get a fine a day than have a man like you represent me (rule me) and tell me what i can and can't do. I have done before but I will never again pay any money to your assn.

Enjoy life attempting to rule the roost..

Thats a big fat agree with him from me!

[Mudde1]

From what Tony has said, the rule will be Retrospective. If you have a cert now, you are fine. If you need to cert or re-cert in the future, these new laws will apply.

the rules willNOT be retrospective.
otherwise you are correct.

[hosehustler]

I saw it ccoming and went just plain whole hog and thumb my nose at all rules and regulations ......No reg, no wof, do what you want to it.
Trailer your weapon to where ya wanna go, and have a shite load of fun without the F'n plague of rule freaks
That to me is the only future here for a decent capable "4X4"

[DaveM]

Is there somewhere that the rules can be viewed?

Anyone know a source that gives standard vehicle heights? Obviously a 3" lift in one brand may be 4" or more.

I assume that the rule will take into account extra height given by tyres also?


Cheers

[DieselBoy]

I saw it ccoming and went just plain whole hog and thumb my nose at all rules and regulations ......No reg, no wof, do what you want to it.
Trailer your weapon to where ya wanna go, and have a shite load of fun without the F'n plague of rule freaks
That to me is the only future here for a decent capable "4X4"

Yeah, same.

I tried to tell the Winch Challenge freaks up here the same thing last year but they just didn't get it.

They couldn't see how they were throwing money away to comply with rules that were totally irrelevant when your in the tough stuff off road in your truck.

Why pay for a WOF, REG, Cert, Insurance, when a trailer costs $35 a year all up.

I do see another catch in the mix though.........

DOC have discovered some rules that are new to them, but have been in place sinxce 2008.

You need a WOF and REG to be on public land.

To get a WOF and REG on your truck you need to be 4x4 club member, a NZ4WDA member, have a Low Volume Certificate, NZ4WDA Authority Weetbix card licence and thrid party insurance.

Again, a membership drive for NZ4WDA??

They know full well what DOC is up to.......

Taking advantage of the situation maybe???

[pruggerdore]

I saw it ccoming and went just plain whole hog and thumb my nose at all rules and regulations ......No reg, no wof, do what you want to it.
Trailer your weapon to where ya wanna go, and have a shite load of fun without the F'n plague of rule freaks
That to me is the only future here for a decent capable "4X4"

yep this is me too and if for some reason such as cant leave trailer and tow wagon somewhere because of thieving little pricks I will illegally drive my super modded no wof/redg/certed truck on the road and if by some freak chance I get pulled up and get pinged with every fine they can give me I will still be saving money compared to trying to keep a highly modded truck legal. Imo they have allready put things in the too hard basket too be worth bothering with. not interested in playin g there silly little game.
what concerns me more is the mention of doc making rules of only road legal vehicles allowed on doc lands. just another rule too dodge i guess... RAGE AGAINST THE MACHINE or bend over and get right royally ..... either way wer all f#ked

[Big Will]

Im still confused, why are they giving the power to the NZ4WDA when once the vehicle has a cert it is deemed road worthy..
Who are the people giving you the seal of approval (the card) at the end of the day?

I can understand the authority's wanting to know the vehicle is being used for what it is built for, but once again they are flexing their YOU WILL DO WHAT I SAY muscle.
I don't enter 4wd events, my truck is almost ready for a cert but i wont be able to drive it on the road? WTF? really?
this thing owes me quite a bit of money and just like that it cant be road legal.. nice..

[Sadam_Husain]

what concerns me more is the mention of doc making rules of only road legal vehicles allowed on doc lands. just another rule too dodge i guess... RAGE AGAINST THE MACHINE or bend over and get right royally ..... either way wer all f#ked

thats not DoC making rules its a statutory requirement on DoC, its been a condition added to all DoC permits in the Wellington conservancy for the past 12 months

[lincooln]

So from I have read, most people want a rolling cert? and I believe this will go a long way to helping with unsafe un-certed trucks etc.

The Authority card is only there to prove you have the need for the lift, I do not agree with the member for one year as new members are punished especially if they have already had a modified truck that will be above the new threshold. Also it should not be retrospective as it is going to piss more people off and is a pain for people such as the example I made above. and has been said before. If your 50, been wheeling since your 15 and are not in a club but have a 150mm lifted truck you know have to park up your truck and wait a year, but to prove you need it you must then buy a second 4wd to use on club trips in the interim to prove you drive off road. NOT FAIR.

Yes Tony you and the NZFWDA are doing a great job and should be commended and yes the consequences of not participating the the rule changes would be catostrophic to our hobby, but there must be a better way to do something? I think maybe a public submission process would have been good to get thoughts on what people would like to see, what they would think would work and wouldn't work. From what I can tell these new rules have been drafted up with no public input what so ever. How can you get a fair idea of what your members position on this is without actually asking them? You seem to be guessing this is what people want.

The logistics of the authority card is going to be hard, and what is stopping the club captains from issuing cards to all members who have applied to get one? Do people who hold the card have to prove club membership of a year or more when presenting the card to WoF or police? Also what happens to club captains if they do give out cards willy nilly? are they going to get fined? the club? assn? Who gets the blame?

Finally there needs to be provision for people who have been wheeling for ages or farmers etc to get an authority card straight away. Maybe don'y have it linked to the club but to the assn only? All that's going to happen with these rules if they come into effect the way they are now, is going to make a lot more illegal vehicles on the road. Short - midterm term maybe but it will happen.

[Drurban]

I can see this is going to be another long thread and an interesting read

[DieselBoy]

Im still confused, why are they giving the power to the NZ4WDA when once the vehicle has a cert it is deemed road worthy..
Who are the people giving you the seal of approval (the card) at the end of the day?

I can understand the authority's wanting to know the vehicle is being used for what it is built for, but once again they are flexing their YOU WILL DO WHAT I SAY muscle.
I don't enter 4wd events, my truck is almost ready for a cert but i wont be able to drive it on the road? WTF? really?
this thing owes me quite a bit of money and just like that it cant be road legal.. nice..

Well, you would just have to leave it in the shed for a year untill you get your soggy weetbix licence.

So that would mean joining a club.

This posses a problem in that:

You can't drive your truck as you can't get it road legal because you don't have the soggy weetbix ticket

You therefore need borrow someone else's truck tha'ts under 50mm lifted so you can attend the compulsory 3 trips before you can be accepted as a club member.

You need to kiss ass to someone so they can also recommend you for member ship, plus some one to second it.

Heaven forbid someone objects to you being a member, then what

your now a 4x4 club member with a truck you can't drive for a year, how do you gain experience??

The club captain gives you your weetbix ticket after a year of member ship, but you haven't driven off road for over a year as you couldn't get your truck legal?? Go figure.

These NZ4WDA boys have really left this whole thing full of holes eh??

I see what they were trying to achieve, but I don't think much of the current ideas are workable and realistic.

[niblik]

if any of this shiat goes through to fruition, thank fawk i've got my trailer queens.

[wjw]

I notice the Certification Threshold document has been taken down from the LVVTA web site:

http://www.lvvta.org.nz/CertThresholdSc ... il04V3.pdf

Thats odd, I wonder if its because they are re-writing the rules

Looks like they re-organised their site:

http://www.lvvta.org.nz/documents/suple ... eshold.pdf

[Big Will]

I noticed that the threshold had been removed, but the VIRM hasn't been re-written yet so its still gospel.

Meh.. Im gonna get my cert before the law change then nuts to this rule, In fact i might lift it another inch or two and fit 37's.

[bda4130]

So, correct me if I'm wrong.. If you currently have a cert for your lift/ mods, you can just ignore all this? This could cause a mad rush for pre-rule change certs!!!

[Lynx]

if any of this shiat goes through to fruition, thank fawk i've got my trailer queens.

Farken Oath.

*plays rage against the machine - Killing in the name off*