I`m thinking about replacing the front drum breaks with discs (and understand that I could bolt Hillux or 60 series ones in- what about surf ones?) thought while I was at it why not set up fiddle breaks
Fiddle Brakes
-
MNC
- Hard Yaka
- Posts: 2100
- Joined: Sun Apr 02, 2006 12:00 pm
- Location: Close to (wishing I was closer to) the Puhoi Pub!
Fiddle Brakes
Does anyone know where I could find some more info on setting up some fiddle breaks in my FJ40?
I`m thinking about replacing the front drum breaks with discs (and understand that I could bolt Hillux or 60 series ones in- what about surf ones?) thought while I was at it why not set up fiddle breaks
I`m thinking about replacing the front drum breaks with discs (and understand that I could bolt Hillux or 60 series ones in- what about surf ones?) thought while I was at it why not set up fiddle breaks
Wopass has done the front disk conversion on his rig, from memory you need the swivel housings off a solid axle hilux and surf calipers and the vented disk off a 60 series
But these calipers don't have a handbrake attatchment so unless you plumb into the hyd lines (not certifiable ) I don't know of any calipers out there that would be big enough to stop a cruiser front end and come with cable brakes , you could look at doing what I've done on my RR and double caliper it (have a llook in the Rover tech section for fiddles)haven't certified it yet but been told by my certifier that it will pass 
Cheers Reece
But these calipers don't have a handbrake attatchment so unless you plumb into the hyd lines (not certifiable
) I don't know of any calipers out there that would be big enough to stop a cruiser front end and come with cable brakes , you could look at doing what I've done on my RR and double caliper it (have a llook in the Rover tech section for fiddles)haven't certified it yet but been told by my certifier that it will pass
Cheers Reece
It seems to be generally accepted that rear fiddles are of greater benefit and they don't load up your CV's. This is if you have a front locker.
Disc's require more mechanical advantage in the brakeing system than drums, you might think about running the 2 lines through a pair of VH44's to get them to lock
J Top
Disc's require more mechanical advantage in the brakeing system than drums, you might think about running the 2 lines through a pair of VH44's to get them to lock
J Top
http://internet.cybermesa.com/~chscully ... discs.html
Heres some good gen on fitting Hilux brakes to the front of a cruiser... theres more links at the bottom of the page.
DeRangeds fiddle setup is nice, I'd do it that way if I was fitting some
Steve
Heres some good gen on fitting Hilux brakes to the front of a cruiser... theres more links at the bottom of the page.
DeRangeds fiddle setup is nice, I'd do it that way if I was fitting some
Steve
Oh gee shucks ya got me all embarissed 
Steve
Oh thought of another way you could do it (fiddle brakes) ..... the front calipers on the Range Rover are a 4 piston caliper in two seperate sets with there own hyd lines.... you could run these onto the rear disk (would give you a 2 piston caliper if you plumbed into one system, this would be good enough for a rear... you'd need all 4 pots for front axle as theres more weight applied and requires more braking) if you did convert it you could plumb the second set to a clutch master off say a hilux for certifiable hyd fiddles
What I got told by the certifier was fiddles couldnn't compremise the "normal" braking if they fail.... why they have to be a seperate system
JTops got a good point rears would be better .... and easyier as you've got more room to play with no steering bs in the way (whats a VH44 :scratch: by the way???)
Cheers Reece
Steve
Oh thought of another way you could do it (fiddle brakes) ..... the front calipers on the Range Rover are a 4 piston caliper in two seperate sets with there own hyd lines.... you could run these onto the rear disk (would give you a 2 piston caliper if you plumbed into one system, this would be good enough for a rear... you'd need all 4 pots for front axle as theres more weight applied and requires more braking) if you did convert it you could plumb the second set to a clutch master off say a hilux for certifiable hyd fiddles
What I got told by the certifier was fiddles couldnn't compremise the "normal" braking if they fail.... why they have to be a seperate system
JTops got a good point rears would be better .... and easyier as you've got more room to play with no steering bs in the way (whats a VH44 :scratch: by the way???)
Cheers Reece
Just a little advise: Dont fit them in line with your excisting power assist servo. Tryed that when fitting rear disc to a cruiser.It gives the brake peddel a whole new feel.Almost like a 2 stage feel. 1st stage ,good, 2nd stage puts you thru the windscreen.
"Oldblue" Electric to Manual Hub Conversion's 03 5447586
Hilman Imp master cylinders (line in and out) ,splitter from your original master cylinder, you'd need to run two lines from the rear up to the fiddle mounting place, along with the fronts run there as well, your master has a front conection along with the rear so put a splitter on each and run to the specific Imp master then to your brake, with using the Imp your foot brake will still operate all wheels as normal and your fiddles will operate independently.
hope this helps.
cheers
hope this helps.
cheers
-
MNC
- Hard Yaka
- Posts: 2100
- Joined: Sun Apr 02, 2006 12:00 pm
- Location: Close to (wishing I was closer to) the Puhoi Pub!
Cheers Nutta. That sounds all good although unfortunately I`m a mechanical retard.
Though I may look at putting some 60 series diffs in that have the hand break on the drums - keep the original handbreak on the driveshaft and then run the two 60 series individual handbreak lines to some fiddle levers in the cab.
Will give me control over the rear two wheels anyway and if I put a locker in the front as well it will just be to assist steering (wont need for traction if all for wheels spinning anway).
What do you reckon
Though I may look at putting some 60 series diffs in that have the hand break on the drums - keep the original handbreak on the driveshaft and then run the two 60 series individual handbreak lines to some fiddle levers in the cab.
Will give me control over the rear two wheels anyway and if I put a locker in the front as well it will just be to assist steering (wont need for traction if all for wheels spinning anway).
What do you reckon
De-Ranged wrote:Oh gee shucks ya got me all embarissed
Oh thought of another way you could do it (fiddle brakes) ..... the front calipers on the Range Rover are a 4 piston caliper in two seperate sets with there own hyd lines.... you could run these onto the rear disk (would give you a 2 piston caliper if you plumbed into one system, this would be good enough for a rear... you'd need all 4 pots for front axle as theres more weight applied and requires more braking) if you did convert it you could plumb the second set to a clutch master off say a hilux for certifiable hyd fiddles
What I got told by the certifier was fiddles couldnn't compremise the "normal" braking if they fail.... why they have to be a seperate system
JTops got a good point rears would be better .... and easyier as you've got more room to play with no steering bs in the way (whats a VH44 :scratch: by the way???)
Cheers Reece
I know what you are saying is in English so why can't I understand a single friggin word
Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.
Benjamin Franklin
Benjamin Franklin
-
mroffroader
- Hard Yaka
- Posts: 2330
- Joined: Sat Mar 25, 2006 12:00 pm
- Location: Lower Hutt WELLINGTON :D
- Contact:
logger2 wrote:The imp masters are more like $50 retail part num p5060 i think most brake specialist shop can get them
try this member "ELMO" he sounds like a imp collector...check out his page http://www.drive.to/imps ....he might have some lying around for cheap...just a thought http://www.offroadexpress.co.nz/modules ... sc&start=0
80 series tow bus towing a redneck ass vitara
I know what you are saying is in English so why can't I understand a single friggin word
did I mention I had two goes at school cert english and JUST made a C- on the second go hard to believe based on my posts the front calipers on the Range Rover are a 4 piston caliper in two seperate sets with there own hyd lines.... you could run these onto the rear disk (would give you a 2 piston caliper if you plumbed into one system
If you have a look at the front disk calipers on a range rover you will see they have two hydrolic lines running in.... they are a 4 piston caliper with 2 seperate systems... the front two pistons are feed from one hyd line and the rear from the second line.... some sort of safety system
What I was suggesting was a legal way of running hydrolic fiddle brakes.... you plumb your brakes to the front two pistons and your fiddle brakes to the rear pistons and since the fiddle brake will only be working on two small pistons I suggested using clutch master cylinders from a hilux as a way of powering it
This would be legal becoase the fiddle brakes are not part of the normal braking system a failure in the fiddle brakes can not effect the vehicles brakes
As for certification I would sugest talking to a certifier before you shell out for the Imp setup as it plums into the normal brake system to my understanding this is illegal
on a bush truck or trials truck is sounds like the bees knees( opps sorry I mean really good)
I hope this helped
Oh and MNC the way I see it your fiddles will be fighting the forward drive from your locked front end, I'd guess they would even out the loss of turning from the locka, if you can afford it, get an ARB that way you can turn it off and get the full bonus from the fiddle brakes
Cheers Reece
Austin Princess have the same type of calliper, duel curcit type.
Just remember that if you use a fixed body calliper, youll need to remove all of the end float from the axle.
Best to look for a floating rail type. this takes care of any axle end play.
Just remember that if you use a fixed body calliper, youll need to remove all of the end float from the axle.
Best to look for a floating rail type. this takes care of any axle end play.
"Oldblue" Electric to Manual Hub Conversion's 03 5447586
De-Ranged wrote :
That's exactly how we've got the front fiddle brakes on the rally truck (ex-Rangy) set up - it works pretty well as long as the pads are dry.
If you have a look at the front disk calipers on a range rover you will see they have two hydrolic lines running in.... they are a 4 piston caliper with 2 seperate systems... the front two pistons are feed from one hyd line and the rear from the second line.... some sort of safety system
What I was suggesting was a legal way of running hydrolic fiddle brakes.... you plumb your brakes to the front two pistons and your fiddle brakes to the rear pistons
That's exactly how we've got the front fiddle brakes on the rally truck (ex-Rangy) set up - it works pretty well as long as the pads are dry.
If at first you don't succeed .... Get a bigger hammer!!
-
MNC
- Hard Yaka
- Posts: 2100
- Joined: Sun Apr 02, 2006 12:00 pm
- Location: Close to (wishing I was closer to) the Puhoi Pub!
Nice work, I still dont understand a thing you are saying - although I new someone who drove an austin princess - sounded awesome looked .... interesting
Pitty you guys are all so far away. This would be a great project - lets all gather around my truck - drink beer and debate about the best way for it to turn corners with front and rear lockers.
Sorry to say next projects are:
1. Sort out my rear locker (one side is not unlocking as it should),
2. Bend up new exhaust , bigger, louder, shorter - just like me so I have room for the drive shaft for the PTO winch. ,
3. PTO winch.
4. Power steering, who needs the gym when you can try and drive on 33"x14"x15" boggers at 15psi in deep mud all day oh yeah with 1.5 tonne pushing them down and any other way than the one you want to go (oh my arms),
5. other non important stuff like the fuel leak from my Holley Carb, and the leaking gasket on the water pump, might even get to the leaking diff seals one day
Then will get on to the fiddle breaks, promise
Pitty you guys are all so far away. This would be a great project - lets all gather around my truck - drink beer and debate about the best way for it to turn corners with front and rear lockers.
Sorry to say next projects are:
1. Sort out my rear locker (one side is not unlocking as it should),
2. Bend up new exhaust , bigger, louder, shorter - just like me
so I have room for the drive shaft for the PTO winch. ,
3. PTO winch.
4. Power steering, who needs the gym when you can try and drive on 33"x14"x15" boggers at 15psi in deep mud all day oh yeah with 1.5 tonne pushing them down and any other way than the one you want to go (oh my arms),
5. other non important stuff like the fuel leak from my Holley Carb, and the leaking gasket on the water pump, might even get to the leaking diff seals one day
Then will get on to the fiddle breaks, promise
i've done a rough diagram below
cheers
cheers
Last edited by NuTTa on Fri Sep 22, 2006 12:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
