water meth for better egts/fuel economy

[slidenyo]

anyone in nz had a dabble with this?
coolingmist pumps only $200 landed

[lax2wlg]

This pump is only $60US + shipping: SHURflo pump #8009-541-236. This is what they all use for 4-cyl/6-cyl engines, great reliability record. Installed a kit on a 12-valve Cummins powered Dodge once.

I think you could put a good kit together for about $250.

[SamLogan]

i have a devilsown methanol injection kit. Easy to install and work really well. Drops my egts by about 100 at 100km/h and seems a bit more powerful. It is also really good at cleaning your engine.

[slidenyo]

and what mixes were run? I've heard the walmart washer fluid mix is 33%
but up to 50% can go in to give a bit more poke.
Can you post some pics of your install please

[Taz]

hello24 had a coolingmist set up on his 1kz and dan something from Chch (maybe chchdan? ) had a lot to say about water/meth 2 or so years ago. 1kz as well from memory.

I've got hellos old set up sitting in a box somewhere now

[KIWI_TERRANO]

Dan Leppord, unsure of his name on here maybe search "meth injection"

He has it on his 1kz and it has made huge difference from the chats with have had,

He first saw the kit while he was at the truck pulls from memory and got hooked on it

[tweake]

the pump is only one part of it.
i would have to check but i don't think any crowd is using shurflow pumps any more.
but the pump is only one part of the system.

using for better egt's is easy enough. fairly common.
however for economy is a lot trickier. one of the problems is for it to gain you economy it has to be running almost constantly which means you go through the meth/water really fast. meth is not cheap.
pre turbo injection is probably the best bet for economy.

[SamLogan]

i run a 30% mix. i was running 50/50 but with the colder air over winter it was actually causing the engine to knock. ddan is the guy you want to talk to as he has been running it for ages. As tweeke said the pump is the common piece between all the different brands. The controllers and nozzles are what sets them apart. The two big ones are devilsown and coolingmist. Try and get an answer out of them as to whose is better, and you will be in for 300 pages of forum debate. I will send a photo of my setup if you want. its hard to see the tank and pump as they are built into my rear draws now so you can't see them.

[lax2wlg]

Weird, research/exp had led me to believe the (maybe older) Devils Own pump were just a Shurflo pump with cool stickers and a higher price. Obviously I am wrong

[tweake]

the older pumps where shurflow for many of the brands, but most have moved away from that and have other manufactures make pumps to their spec. so there is a bit of difference between manufactures as each has their own idea of whats best or cheapest.

as far as mic goes it depends on what your trying to achieve.
water doesn't evaporate much under boost pressure. so it primarily does the in cylinder cooling ie good for reducing egt's.
alcohol evaporates easily and does the intake air cooling.
pre turbo, in small amounts both will evaporate. water actually has more cooling ability than the alcohol.
also alcohol is fuel and adds to the egt's.

[slidenyo]

all good points what size nozzles do you guys run?
any reason I can't buy a pump then grab some fittings and solenoids from norgren and piece this together?
ebay kit with controller is $800
pump is $200 seems a lot extra for some fittings and a switch box that activates on boost.
my plan was to run an auberin egt gauge and run the solenoids/relay to the nozzle/pump off the buzzer circuit,
if I set that buzzer just above optimum egts then the water meth can kick in and run till it drops back below.

[tweake]

what size engine and boost?
you will need to get a rage of nozzles to fine tune it.
the solenoid option is a good idea especially if you go pre turbo.

for egt control straight water is best tho a little meth to stop it freezing in cold weather is ok.
the rule with egt control is to inject early. ie stop it getting hot rather than try to bring temps back down.
theres a few write ups on which setup os best ie boost injection vers egt sensor.

[micahb]

Im running devils own set up. 1gph nozzle pre turbo and 4gph at intake manifold. Havnt got the fancy controller that varies like ddan, mine just kicks on at 10psi or whatever i set it to. Works brilliant on my manual pumpd 1KZ. I only run water as its free but did buy some meth in the beginning, best i found was 20% meth 80% water. But thats for my wagon, every bodys tune is different. Ddans has been dynoed and had alot of time spent on it. It bloody hauls arse. Im not running an intercooler yet but egts cruising at 100 are round 550 normal, get boost up just enough and they drop to 450. Be even better when i do the WTA intercooler.

[slidenyo]

having talked about it with a mate i'd probably start with it on my rover or
our bush truck, both ld28's both turbo,
still looking at what boost to run but i'd say the l20et turbo I have will make up to 15 psi fairly easily.
the rover is to be intercooled from the outset.
rather than running off boost i'd run off that buzzer circuit which from your guys advice i'd set just below optimum egt's then it will cut the supply before it can drop them too low and put the fire out.

[tweake]

1-2 gph (@100psi) preturbo
2-4 gph after intercooler.

the thing to watch is design of intake and any joins. water injected after the turbo won't evaporate and washes down the intake pipes. it can seep out of any poor joins. it can also have trouble trying to flow through some log style manifolds.

someone had an egt amp which enabled the injection controller to run off egt sensor. that way you had variable rate injection.

[strx7]

I have 3 nozzles set in 2 stages on my 80 series, at 4psi i have a 180cc nozzle kicking in, and at 9psi I have 2x 360cc nozzles coming in, I have them all selectable on toggle switches so I can run any particular nozzle I want, or any combination of them. I run 40% methanol and 60% water. It doesn't give quite as much cooling at 33% methanol/67% water, But I dispise hills when I'm towing so like being able to do the speed limit up them.
FWIW I'm running 15psi from a late model STi subaru turbo + a front mount intercooler.

[darinz]

Just thinking out loud but with an old indirect injection motor (TD42), the biggest damage is caused by the temp coming out of the pre-combustion chamber. So if you inject water / meth this will lower the EGT but NOT the temp coming out the of the pre-comp? So does this mean having a lower EGT will appear good but the damage to the piston still happen???

[tweake]

i would have to look it up but i think the water gets in the way of combustion a bit, so it should reduce flame temps ie precup temps.

[bombaybasher]

just run a decent intercooler, water/meth does work good though, i had a really basic kit on my supercharged xr8 falcon which just used a windscreen washer pump and pressure switch with a brass jet which gave a really fine mist,i swapped it for an intercooler eventually which was alot more consistent and it used to go through shitloads of methanol - just if you run too much meth on a diesel your engine will knock badly.

[strx7]

just run a decent intercooler, water/meth does work good though, i had a really basic kit on my supercharged xr8 falcon which just used a windscreen washer pump and pressure switch with a brass jet which gave a really fine mist,i swapped it for an intercooler eventually which was alot more consistent and it used to go through shitloads of methanol - just if you run too much meth on a diesel your engine will knock badly.

water & meths with give alot better rewards than on a petrol, unless you spend the time and effort on the petrol and tune it to a point that it relies on the water & meths going in, which can have disasterous results if you run out.