At the NZFWDA annual conference in Wellington on May 19 during a presentation by Mr Paul Stigley of DOC, we were advised that the intention is to have a proposed law, closing all DOC lands to vehicles unless permitted by notice, being put to Parliament in August this year.
This planned law will have far reaching effects on a wide range of recreations including 4x4. It will also ban vehicles from many beach areas.
Time maybe to talk to your local MP's and tell them what you think of the idea!
Proposed DOC law- all land closed to vehicles without permit
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PeterVahry
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Just think about it:
If the Land is closed, how much easier is it for DOC to say "NO" rather than "YES, just wait I'll do some work and give you a permit, even though I personally think no vehicles should be in there at all."
- "it's always easier to say no" a quote from an ex DOC aquaintance of mine.
Cynical, well maybe, but I have seen this happen in our local area in the past, when a road was closed to vehicles for sometime due to some cock and bull reason. The local guy, now retired, was adamant that 'he' did not want vehicles going into that road.
They don't like to hear people talk about 'rights' and at present the Land 'belongs' to the people of New Zealand. If they close it by default for vehicle access - then you can kiss you access good bye, regardless of what the overtures are. You will end up with a couple of 'token' roads available to you.
Currently the land is open by default and only closed if there is a problem, to which they need to give notice. We should be fighting for our 'rights'; percieved, real or otherwise.
I will be sending a letter to my MP.
As ANYONE reading this thread should, no- MUST make a submission to thier MP.
It scares me, but everytime 'they' parliament passes one of these pieces of policy, they we loose some of our freedoms and everyone just sits and lets it happen instead of making a noise. Do you really want to have to apply for permission to go where you go freely now? Do you think it will stop the bad element from going there? They will go in regardless permit or not and only us law abiding citizens will be kept out.
No, stand up for your rights and have your voice heard, write to your MP, like Peter suggests..
There you go, now I'm all worked up...
John
If the Land is closed, how much easier is it for DOC to say "NO" rather than "YES, just wait I'll do some work and give you a permit, even though I personally think no vehicles should be in there at all."
- "it's always easier to say no" a quote from an ex DOC aquaintance of mine.
Cynical, well maybe, but I have seen this happen in our local area in the past, when a road was closed to vehicles for sometime due to some cock and bull reason. The local guy, now retired, was adamant that 'he' did not want vehicles going into that road.
They don't like to hear people talk about 'rights' and at present the Land 'belongs' to the people of New Zealand. If they close it by default for vehicle access - then you can kiss you access good bye, regardless of what the overtures are. You will end up with a couple of 'token' roads available to you.
Currently the land is open by default and only closed if there is a problem, to which they need to give notice. We should be fighting for our 'rights'; percieved, real or otherwise.
I will be sending a letter to my MP.
As ANYONE reading this thread should, no- MUST make a submission to thier MP.
It scares me, but everytime 'they' parliament passes one of these pieces of policy, they we loose some of our freedoms and everyone just sits and lets it happen instead of making a noise. Do you really want to have to apply for permission to go where you go freely now? Do you think it will stop the bad element from going there? They will go in regardless permit or not and only us law abiding citizens will be kept out.
No, stand up for your rights and have your voice heard, write to your MP, like Peter suggests..
There you go, now I'm all worked up...
John
-Vehicle: Rangie - 4 Wheels, 3 doors, Engine, Gearbox, other whirly bits, Steering wheel, Radio, Seats, Pedal that makes noise, pedal thats stops it, and pedal that helps stop the crunching noise when using the gear lever.
http://www.feilding4x4.org
http://www.feilding4x4.org
Fair enough, and that is exactly how i would expect things to go. I would like to hear the full ins and outs of what the proposal is before thinking the worst..... however sometimes it becomes too late to do anything.
Clubs may benefit from such a move however. Possibly the only access/permits would be via reputable clubs, hence the clubs would inherit more members. (trying to look on the bright side here... i prefer to do my own thing anyway)
Clubs may benefit from such a move however. Possibly the only access/permits would be via reputable clubs, hence the clubs would inherit more members. (trying to look on the bright side here... i prefer to do my own thing anyway)
/| , [____],
l----L -OlllllllO-
()_) ()_)-----)_)
KEEP'N JEEP'N!
l----L -OlllllllO-
()_) ()_)-----)_)
KEEP'N JEEP'N!
No, it's never too late.
There are no ins and outs, the proposal is CLOSED by default. It is that you need to get your voice heard on.
As I said you don't want to be giving away what you currently have. There is no good reason for it.
Furthermore, I would think the worst. Most of the 'committees' in place are over represented by the preservationist lobby.
There is no bright side for us, and why give anything away with out a fight? How can reputable clubs benefit when they already have access now, why the need to apply for a permit to something we already have the 'right' to use. I don't see any logical reason for it except the preservationist agenda, or some control in the form of revenue gathering (do you think a permit will be free?) Even if it is, you don't need one now.
John
There are no ins and outs, the proposal is CLOSED by default. It is that you need to get your voice heard on.
As I said you don't want to be giving away what you currently have. There is no good reason for it.
Furthermore, I would think the worst. Most of the 'committees' in place are over represented by the preservationist lobby.
There is no bright side for us, and why give anything away with out a fight? How can reputable clubs benefit when they already have access now, why the need to apply for a permit to something we already have the 'right' to use. I don't see any logical reason for it except the preservationist agenda, or some control in the form of revenue gathering (do you think a permit will be free?) Even if it is, you don't need one now.
John
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Sadam_Husain
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I havent sat down and read through the conservation act for 8-9 years but my understanding was it is already written into the act that any vehicle (as interprited by the transport act with or with out wheels), vessile or aircraft (less than 500m? above doc land) requires a permit to access doc land?
This has always affected me personaly as I own a bach on doc land, one of about 60 in the orongorongo valley of the Rimutaka forest park. All the baches were legaly established and permitted many years/decades prior to DoC (NZFS as they were then) aquiring the land from the wellington regional waterboard in a land transfer agreement in 1980. We were all issued new bach licences by doc/NZFS from this point and our 24/7 access by vehicle was closed immediately. Our bach licences state vehicles can only enter the doc land be permit, doc then require us to comply with the CMS (Conservation management stratagey for Wgtn) which states access to the orongorongo valley by vehicle is only permitted for bach licencees 7 times per year.
We've got a club which is a bach owners assoc of around 300 members that negociates on our behalf for access and although we probably get access around 11 times per year and not the 7 times permitted by the CMS we have never been able to enter by vehicle without a permit.
This has always affected me personaly as I own a bach on doc land, one of about 60 in the orongorongo valley of the Rimutaka forest park. All the baches were legaly established and permitted many years/decades prior to DoC (NZFS as they were then) aquiring the land from the wellington regional waterboard in a land transfer agreement in 1980. We were all issued new bach licences by doc/NZFS from this point and our 24/7 access by vehicle was closed immediately. Our bach licences state vehicles can only enter the doc land be permit, doc then require us to comply with the CMS (Conservation management stratagey for Wgtn) which states access to the orongorongo valley by vehicle is only permitted for bach licencees 7 times per year.
We've got a club which is a bach owners assoc of around 300 members that negociates on our behalf for access and although we probably get access around 11 times per year and not the 7 times permitted by the CMS we have never been able to enter by vehicle without a permit.
Re: Proposed DOC law- all land closed to vehicles without pe
PeterVahry wrote:At the NZFWDA annual conference in Wellington on May 19 during a presentation by Mr Paul Stigley of DOC, we were advised that the intention is to have a proposed law, closing all DOC lands to vehicles unless permitted by notice, being put to Parliament in August this year.
This planned law will have far reaching effects on a wide range of recreations including 4x4. It will also ban vehicles from many beach areas.
Time maybe to talk to your local MP's and tell them what you think of the idea!
I would have thought that this would have required a Public Discussion paper in the first instance, on their site - but alas - I can't seem to find one at all. Perhaps they are concerned at the possible backlash it would generate, and thereby wish to "sneak" it in under the radar so-to-speak.
The public has already lost a fair amount of vehicular access to the Ahuriri Area after DOC purchased Birchwood Station, as part of the tenure review - for the princely sum of $10M. Then proceeded to fence & gate off areas that "someone" in DOC felt no longer needed 4WD access to (Canyon Creek).
This area was previously accessable to many 4WD for numerous years - and then suddenly No Longer.
DOC then wondered why there were protests at the so called "Opening" (should have been "Closing") of the area to the public.
Unfortunately, part of the "protests" involved 4WD'ers pulling the fences down, and gates out with their vehicles, to maintain their access rights. Which of course sets DOC in a negative frame of mind towards 4WD's.
I will be contacting my MP and voicing my concern at the erosion of peoples access to the peoples land. I believe that is what DOC are supposed to be engendering - and not putting their proviso's on how, when and where
My 2 cents worth & little rant
Baldrick
91 Cruiser VX Ltd Auto Diesel Turbo *Safari snorkel * 80mm RAW suspension lift * Custom Bull-bar * 33" MT tyres * 26Mhz & UHF CB units * West Coast Rust * And a partridge in a pear tree! Oh... and an awesome new Co-Pilot
91 Cruiser VX Ltd Auto Diesel Turbo *Safari snorkel * 80mm RAW suspension lift * Custom Bull-bar * 33" MT tyres * 26Mhz & UHF CB units * West Coast Rust * And a partridge in a pear tree! Oh... and an awesome new Co-Pilot
Re: land
coxsy wrote:don't think i can talk to my M P he's up on charges
Could always offer him a hand or re-tile his roof
in return for his support I guess 
Baldrick
91 Cruiser VX Ltd Auto Diesel Turbo *Safari snorkel * 80mm RAW suspension lift * Custom Bull-bar * 33" MT tyres * 26Mhz & UHF CB units * West Coast Rust * And a partridge in a pear tree! Oh... and an awesome new Co-Pilot
91 Cruiser VX Ltd Auto Diesel Turbo *Safari snorkel * 80mm RAW suspension lift * Custom Bull-bar * 33" MT tyres * 26Mhz & UHF CB units * West Coast Rust * And a partridge in a pear tree! Oh... and an awesome new Co-Pilot
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Leithfield
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Re: land
Baldrick wrote:coxsy wrote:don't think i can talk to my M P he's up on charges
Could always offer him a hand or re-tile his roof
This issue is too important to be hi-jaacked, lets keep this one on track!
Pass the word to your club,s mates etc..to get a letter to thier MP, in Jail or not, thtas the most important issue.
John
-Vehicle: Rangie - 4 Wheels, 3 doors, Engine, Gearbox, other whirly bits, Steering wheel, Radio, Seats, Pedal that makes noise, pedal thats stops it, and pedal that helps stop the crunching noise when using the gear lever.
http://www.feilding4x4.org
http://www.feilding4x4.org
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PeterVahry
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This is a quote from the DOC presentation:
"The legislation is, if I can remind you - as after all it has been some time now - called the Conservation Authorisations, Compliance and Enforcement Bill (an unappealing mouthful).
At present DOC land is open unless it is closed by by-law or regulation. In summary, the proposed legislation is that off-road vehicle use (other than bicycles) be prohibited unless allowed by notice."
"To recap - its purpose is to develop a flexible regime which allows access at particular places and times and which also protects fragile ecosystems.
It is all about allowing flexible decisions on access being made where appropriate. Here in the summer but not the winter because it is too wet - there in the winter but not the summer because of fire hazard - special four wheel drive groups to a special place on a special day.
We do not have that flexibility at the moment to make appropriate decisions.
It is about what is appropriate not about rights. It is about balance and sustainability. It is not only about now - but the future."
Now, just to keep you all busy....this suggested permission and "flexibility" has another level to overcome which is the Conservation Management Strategies (CMS) which are gradually being reviewd around the conservancies. If a Conservation Board decides that vehicles should not be allowed on conservation land in their conservancy then that over-rides the ability to allow vehicle access.
Currently that is the situation in the Tongariro Taupo Conservancy....that existing CMS does not allow recreational vehicle use anywhere in that conservancy except the 42 Traverse for a limited summer season. (and that took five years of strong argument to get that option!)
This means that 4x4 recreation must ensure that MP's are lobbied and that our recreation is not written out of existence through the CMS process.
"The legislation is, if I can remind you - as after all it has been some time now - called the Conservation Authorisations, Compliance and Enforcement Bill (an unappealing mouthful).
At present DOC land is open unless it is closed by by-law or regulation. In summary, the proposed legislation is that off-road vehicle use (other than bicycles) be prohibited unless allowed by notice."
"To recap - its purpose is to develop a flexible regime which allows access at particular places and times and which also protects fragile ecosystems.
It is all about allowing flexible decisions on access being made where appropriate. Here in the summer but not the winter because it is too wet - there in the winter but not the summer because of fire hazard - special four wheel drive groups to a special place on a special day.
We do not have that flexibility at the moment to make appropriate decisions.
It is about what is appropriate not about rights. It is about balance and sustainability. It is not only about now - but the future."
Now, just to keep you all busy....this suggested permission and "flexibility" has another level to overcome which is the Conservation Management Strategies (CMS) which are gradually being reviewd around the conservancies. If a Conservation Board decides that vehicles should not be allowed on conservation land in their conservancy then that over-rides the ability to allow vehicle access.
Currently that is the situation in the Tongariro Taupo Conservancy....that existing CMS does not allow recreational vehicle use anywhere in that conservancy except the 42 Traverse for a limited summer season. (and that took five years of strong argument to get that option!)
This means that 4x4 recreation must ensure that MP's are lobbied and that our recreation is not written out of existence through the CMS process.
draft a sample letter we could copy and send to our loca MP 
:scratch:Sadam_Husain wrote:I havent sat down and read through the conservation act for 8-9 years but my understanding was it is already written into the act that any vehicle (as interprited by the transport act with or with out wheels), vessile or aircraft (less than 500m? above doc land) requires a permit to access doc land?
We've got a club which is a bach owners assoc of around 300 members that negociates on our behalf for access and although we probably get access around 11 times per year and not the 7 times permitted by the CMS we have never been able to enter by vehicle without a permit.
I work closely with our local Doc manager here and I get from him that a Doc permit has only ever been required for three things (thats locally of course) Hunting(firearm etc), dog, Horse -(true as my wife has held one for entry). -Which I have to note that they're really really bad at policing already let alone more things - Have you ever seen a doc ranger in the bush on a weekend - they are public servants after all
I understand the bach permit thing though. Local areas will require different rules I assume. All they did in the central north Island is pull everything down that they didn't make.
The vehicle permit thing will for sure be hard pushed by a majority in Doc, thanks Peter for the eyes up on it. Maybe this one will attract the attention of some of the thousands of hunters out there too (they access doc land by vehicle too most times)
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skid
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Fair enough, and that is exactly how i would expect things to go. I would like to hear the full ins and outs of what the proposal is before thinking the worst..... however sometimes it becomes too late to do anything.
You're right about the fact that sometimes it becomes too late to do anything. most of the time everyone just sits on thier ass and says to themselves "oh I should really write this time" , but then they hear that the road has been closed and we lose another area to drive. I know coz I've done this myself, but not any more. with forums like this we can all be kept up to date and get submissions etc in so that we are heard and not taken lightly.
I live in Taupo and 3 members of our club fought hard to get the 42 traverse reopened, yet we are only allowed to use use it for 5 months of the year and all the other user groups get to use it year round, yet we are the only user group who turn up once a year to a working bee. and still we lose out on good access. 4wd users throughout NZ have always had a bad rep and unless we stand up and be counted and make ourselves heard, everyone will still have the wrong opinion of us.
We now have lots more organised safaris, 2 great magazines, a decent amount of tv coverage( mostly positive), so lets get ourselves heard.
Even if you were no good at skool, you can still write to your local MP. You just write and tell him a simple explanation about how pissed you are at the amount of areas we are losing for recreation.
GO FORTH AND WRITE !!!!!!!
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PeterVahry
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Just a little more background on this proposed law.
Has anyone ever heard of DOC taking anyone to Court over using a vehicle on DOC land? Probably not, because that's DOC's problem..the present laws don't cover that! They can prosecute for damage caused, but that's often hard to quantify. There are a few areas that have specific By-laws about vehicle use and those can be applied in Court.
What DOC want to do with the new law is to avoid making a large number of area specific By-laws because they have to be drafted to apply to an area. The new law is a sledge hammer being used on a small nut. (Ok a lot of 4x4 nutters)
DOC did talk with some NZFWDA people over two years ago and there was acknowledgment by NZFWDA representatives that some controls could be useful in some areas. At that time the Macetown damage was an example used. In theory the concept could work to the advantage of organised 4x4 recreation which was recognised too. What was not clear at that time was the potential impact that an unfavourable CMS would have. With an automatic ban from the law combined with a possible ban by CMS, the outcome looks rather dismal.
With the MMP situation is is possible that this proposed law might falter but it will need everyone to make it clear to their MP that votes are at stake. Obviously the Greens will be in favour of restricting 4x4 recreation.
Has anyone ever heard of DOC taking anyone to Court over using a vehicle on DOC land? Probably not, because that's DOC's problem..the present laws don't cover that! They can prosecute for damage caused, but that's often hard to quantify. There are a few areas that have specific By-laws about vehicle use and those can be applied in Court.
What DOC want to do with the new law is to avoid making a large number of area specific By-laws because they have to be drafted to apply to an area. The new law is a sledge hammer being used on a small nut. (Ok a lot of 4x4 nutters)
DOC did talk with some NZFWDA people over two years ago and there was acknowledgment by NZFWDA representatives that some controls could be useful in some areas. At that time the Macetown damage was an example used. In theory the concept could work to the advantage of organised 4x4 recreation which was recognised too. What was not clear at that time was the potential impact that an unfavourable CMS would have. With an automatic ban from the law combined with a possible ban by CMS, the outcome looks rather dismal.
With the MMP situation is is possible that this proposed law might falter but it will need everyone to make it clear to their MP that votes are at stake. Obviously the Greens will be in favour of restricting 4x4 recreation.
we all need to write to our mps, as 4wders are also voters and they need to know just how many there are. the problem with doc is they have too much power. with my last job at opc i had dealings with doc taupo turangi all the time as we were on doc land, operated on doc land and had a lodge at tukino on the eastern side of ruapehu , if they had their way we could not even look at the mountains let alone go near them and the same for the bush unless you ride a mountain bike of course! together something can be done about this!!.
vaughan
vaughan
Just thought i would bump this up to the top of the list to make sure everyone sees it. This is scary stuff. Im still pritty young and there is alot of this country that i havnt seen yet. Realisticly unless i can take my truck there then I probably wont see most of it. There are so many places that you can go by 4wd that the majority of people in the country will never see.
How much land is there that isnt private that doc don;t controll? Just how much of OUR country does this affect (excuse my igronance).
Pete
How much land is there that isnt private that doc don;t controll? Just how much of OUR country does this affect (excuse my igronance).
Pete
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PeterVahry
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PeterVahry wrote:Pete, the bad news is that DOC administer 1/3rd of New Zealand now and still growing!
Not a hi-jack...
Saw this on a billboard in January:
DOC - where good land goes to die!!
Baldrick
91 Cruiser VX Ltd Auto Diesel Turbo *Safari snorkel * 80mm RAW suspension lift * Custom Bull-bar * 33" MT tyres * 26Mhz & UHF CB units * West Coast Rust * And a partridge in a pear tree! Oh... and an awesome new Co-Pilot
91 Cruiser VX Ltd Auto Diesel Turbo *Safari snorkel * 80mm RAW suspension lift * Custom Bull-bar * 33" MT tyres * 26Mhz & UHF CB units * West Coast Rust * And a partridge in a pear tree! Oh... and an awesome new Co-Pilot
that billboard didnt happen to be just out of roxburgh did it?
there was another there that read
during DOCs reign in NZ nothing happened...
we need to go back to the good old forest service i think eitha that or doc needs to start lookin after every1s intrests not just the few who want everything to be the way it was 300 years ago
there was another there that read
during DOCs reign in NZ nothing happened...
we need to go back to the good old forest service i think eitha that or doc needs to start lookin after every1s intrests not just the few who want everything to be the way it was 300 years ago
Thats the story! take that sentiment and write to your MP, or anyone else you can.
John
John
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http://www.feilding4x4.org
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Steve_t647
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I sent an email and mentioned that all the fishermen, hunters and 4wd owners usualy have a fire extinguisher in their 4wd and remove all their rubbish and other's.
On several trips I have been on with a club we have removed rubbish from the huts. Has anyone used an extinguisher to put out a fire on DOC land?
we like this country too and a 4wd means we can see it and still get to work on Monday!
On several trips I have been on with a club we have removed rubbish from the huts. Has anyone used an extinguisher to put out a fire on DOC land?
we like this country too and a 4wd means we can see it and still get to work on Monday!
The Bill that has been referred to here (Conservation Authorisations, Compliance and Enforcement Bill) does not seem to exist. I have researched the Beehive web site and looked up all Bills under review and due to be bought before the house and or select committees. It seems not to exist. Some how we either have the name wrong, or this is a great big con! We need to establish what we are actually talking about here before people rush off and write and or talk to MP’s as to take off with no facts will make us all look stupid.
So can anyone find out the following:-
1 Which MP is proposing tis bill? (the MP’s Name)
2 What is it (the Bill) actually called? (Searching :- Conservation Authorisations, Compliance and Enforcement Bill comes up with nothing)
Once we actually establish the facts and see where the Bill sits on the parliament calendar we can see what we are actually dealing with here.
Cheers
Paul
So can anyone find out the following:-
1 Which MP is proposing tis bill? (the MP’s Name)
2 What is it (the Bill) actually called? (Searching :- Conservation Authorisations, Compliance and Enforcement Bill comes up with nothing)
Once we actually establish the facts and see where the Bill sits on the parliament calendar we can see what we are actually dealing with here.
Cheers
Paul
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PeterVahry
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If DOC are doing a con then it's an elaborate one!
The name of the proposed Bill is as on the original message and was transcribed from the speech notes as presented to the NZFWDA conference by a senior DOC person.
If it has not reached the Parliamentary system then that's fine but rest assured it will appear. DOC have had senior policy people working on this project for over two years.
It does not mean that we can sit back and wait but it does mean that for once we have a window of time to get ourselves in a position to better counter the inevitable. Talk to your MP's about the possibility and find out if they give a rats arse about it. If they don't care about 4 wheeling constituents then at least you know not to waste your time with them in future.
DOC or the Minister may not even put the Bill forward if the mood of Parliament is not favourable, as the Labour Party will not want another hard time. However all it would need is for an incident or situation with vehicle caused damage that they could capitalise on for public sympathy and you can bet that this Bill would be whipped out and crashed through.
By all means be a sceptic but look at the early warning as a small advantage to us.
The name of the proposed Bill is as on the original message and was transcribed from the speech notes as presented to the NZFWDA conference by a senior DOC person.
If it has not reached the Parliamentary system then that's fine but rest assured it will appear. DOC have had senior policy people working on this project for over two years.
It does not mean that we can sit back and wait but it does mean that for once we have a window of time to get ourselves in a position to better counter the inevitable. Talk to your MP's about the possibility and find out if they give a rats arse about it. If they don't care about 4 wheeling constituents then at least you know not to waste your time with them in future.
DOC or the Minister may not even put the Bill forward if the mood of Parliament is not favourable, as the Labour Party will not want another hard time. However all it would need is for an incident or situation with vehicle caused damage that they could capitalise on for public sympathy and you can bet that this Bill would be whipped out and crashed through.
By all means be a sceptic but look at the early warning as a small advantage to us.
It is mentioned as an upcoming bill:
"9274 (2006). Gordon Copeland to the Minister of Conservation (21 Jul 2006):
What is the Department of Conservation doing to try to prevent illegal animal releases?
Hon Chris Carter (Minister of Conservation) replied:
Illegal animal releases onto public conservation lands threaten our natural indigenous heritage. Some conservancies maintain active surveillance programmes and seek to shoot deer and pigs known to have been illegally released. Other conservancies carry out day-to-day surveillance within actively managed sites, where every attempt is made to remove illegally released deer and pigs. The proposed Conservation (Authorisations) Compliance and Law Enforcement Bill will impose tough prison terms and fines for people who, for example, sabotage wildlife sanctuaries by illegal animal releases. At present a person who releases a deer or a pig in a nature reserve is liable to one month in prison or a $500 fine. In the proposed legislation, this will be increased to a maximum of one year in prison or a fine of up to $100,000. "
This is a question to Chris carter in which he mentions the 'proposed' bill.
It may be talking about illegal animal releases here, but from DoCs comments at the AGM it includes access issues as well. One of the problems they have is actual enforcement issues, which is why they want to close places, so then anyone in there can be prosecuted, whereas now they can't or it's too difficult. As usual using a sledghammer to bang in a tack.
John
"9274 (2006). Gordon Copeland to the Minister of Conservation (21 Jul 2006):
What is the Department of Conservation doing to try to prevent illegal animal releases?
Hon Chris Carter (Minister of Conservation) replied:
Illegal animal releases onto public conservation lands threaten our natural indigenous heritage. Some conservancies maintain active surveillance programmes and seek to shoot deer and pigs known to have been illegally released. Other conservancies carry out day-to-day surveillance within actively managed sites, where every attempt is made to remove illegally released deer and pigs. The proposed Conservation (Authorisations) Compliance and Law Enforcement Bill will impose tough prison terms and fines for people who, for example, sabotage wildlife sanctuaries by illegal animal releases. At present a person who releases a deer or a pig in a nature reserve is liable to one month in prison or a $500 fine. In the proposed legislation, this will be increased to a maximum of one year in prison or a fine of up to $100,000. "
This is a question to Chris carter in which he mentions the 'proposed' bill.
It may be talking about illegal animal releases here, but from DoCs comments at the AGM it includes access issues as well. One of the problems they have is actual enforcement issues, which is why they want to close places, so then anyone in there can be prosecuted, whereas now they can't or it's too difficult. As usual using a sledghammer to bang in a tack.
John
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[quote="access4WD"]The process of moving a “Proposalâ€
Last edited by jdeburgh on Thu May 31, 2007 9:20 am, edited 2 times in total.
-Vehicle: Rangie - 4 Wheels, 3 doors, Engine, Gearbox, other whirly bits, Steering wheel, Radio, Seats, Pedal that makes noise, pedal thats stops it, and pedal that helps stop the crunching noise when using the gear lever.
http://www.feilding4x4.org
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PeterVahry
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Paul, I'm not going to get into a stupid debate over the niceties of the Parliamentary process or your views.
There is a Bill that has been drafted by DOC that is waiting in the wings. While it may not appear anytime soon, that is a matter of conjecture and yes there may be change in MP's but...do people know if their existing MP has any interest in our potential problem? If there is no interest then maybe people need to consider working to change that MP to someone with favourable interest!
By all means continue to work with DOC on the ground but ignore the politics at your peril.
By the way, have you noticed the increasing use of the word "wilderness" in DOC material? Could it have a parallel to the concept sweeping the USA that is shutting huge areas to vehicle use but is still open for "public" use (if they can get there)?
There is a Bill that has been drafted by DOC that is waiting in the wings. While it may not appear anytime soon, that is a matter of conjecture and yes there may be change in MP's but...do people know if their existing MP has any interest in our potential problem? If there is no interest then maybe people need to consider working to change that MP to someone with favourable interest!
By all means continue to work with DOC on the ground but ignore the politics at your peril.
By the way, have you noticed the increasing use of the word "wilderness" in DOC material? Could it have a parallel to the concept sweeping the USA that is shutting huge areas to vehicle use but is still open for "public" use (if they can get there)?