Mod's and certifications

[dannyboy4949]

Hey Fella's

When looking to purchase a truck with mod's already done by the current owner, is there any need to be dubious if he hasnt got it certified? The guy said a 50mm lift and spring 2" spring lift was legal and didnt need to be certifed.

Would a testing station or any other place still give it a wof with a certification for the mods?

Also how easy is it to obtain a certification? and would a pre-purchase inspection provide some assurance it woud get a certification?

Many thanks again

Dan

[albundy]

go to the ltsa website that shopuld help. My understanding is that if you change your body mount blocks then it needs certifying. My old terrano had mods that never got certed, was always going to but I rolled it. My safari has the same mods, but was all certified by the previous owner. The insurance company certainly took notice of the certification.
Al

[Smurf]

A mate just failed warrant yesterday , 40mm bodylift not certed. WOF done at vehicle testing station that runs in conjunction with local certifier. They told him all body lifts need certing now????

[DaveM]

A mate just failed warrant yesterday , 40mm bodylift not certed. WOF done at vehicle testing station that runs in conjunction with local certifier. They told him all body lifts need certing now????

I was told about 3-4 years ago that body lifts need certifying as it was a mod. to the bodymount securing. Problem was, that a lot of wof testers didn't really pick up on it, as there seems to be a HUGE divide in the standard a vehicle needs to be up to, depending on where you go.

Just because you get a wof, doesnt mean that insurance will pay out if you right it off. They will look for anything to get out of it.

I would rather fail, and know about the need for a cert than believe the trucks ok when in fact it may not be.
Its a real PITA, I run 33's on the Safari, and told by the local testing station, and VTNZ that its within the limits. I'm not too sure, so I'm going to do a body lift, get 35's and get the thing certed.

[mud_slinger]

dont take it to a testin station i take mine to a guy who 4wd's so he understands. dont get me wrong he thoroughly checks it and everything jus ignores stuff like body lifts and all that.as long as its safe and he's happy wit it its all good

[dannyboy4949]

A mate just failed warrant yesterday , 40mm bodylift not certed. WOF done at vehicle testing station that runs in conjunction with local certifier. They told him all body lifts need certing now????

I was told about 3-4 years ago that body lifts need certifying as it was a mod. to the bodymount securing. Problem was, that a lot of wof testers didn't really pick up on it, as there seems to be a HUGE divide in the standard a vehicle needs to be up to, depending on where you go.

Just because you get a wof, doesnt mean that insurance will pay out if you right it off. They will look for anything to get out of it.

I would rather fail, and know about the need for a cert than believe the trucks ok when in fact it may not be.
Its a real PITA, I run 33's on the Safari, and told by the local testing station, and VTNZ that its within the limits. I'm not too sure, so I'm going to do a body lift, get 35's and get the thing certed.

Yeah I made enquiries today and AMI wouldnt touch the thing when I mentioned there were modification that were not certified. So I told the guy and he went down today and check the a place who certifies mod's. They said the law had changed and mod's now need to be certified - so he has booked it in tomorrow. I am phoning back AMI tonight to see what price it will cost to insure with certified mods.

[SupraLux]

To clarify:

2" spring lift does NOT require cert if the springs still use the factory mounting positions...in fact ANY spring lift does not require cert up to a lift or something rediculous like 4 meters! As long as it uses the factory spring mounts. I believe the Aussie system will be coming in here (if its not already) which will reduce the spring-lift allowance to either 50 or 60mm before a cert will be required at some point in the near future.

ANY body lift requires certification - reason given by the LTSA - it changes the centre of gravity of the vehicle...

...doesn't a spring lift do that too? LTSA: Low-intelligence Terribly Stupid Assholes...

Steve

[MNC]

... Yeah I made enquiries today and AMI wouldnt touch the thing when I mentioned there were modification that were not certified. So I told the guy and he went down today and check the a place who certifies mod's. They said the law had changed and mod's now need to be certified - so he has booked it in tomorrow. I am phoning back AMI tonight to see what price it will cost to insure with certified mods.

Hey man, can you post up what they say - I'd be interested to hear what effect it has on the cost of your insurance.

[DaveM]

My mods are listed with State and my Premiums stay the same

[4WDbits]

... Yeah I made enquiries today and AMI wouldnt touch the thing when I mentioned there were modification that were not certified. So I told the guy and he went down today and check the a place who certifies mod's. They said the law had changed and mod's now need to be certified - so he has booked it in tomorrow. I am phoning back AMI tonight to see what price it will cost to insure with certified mods.

Hey man, can you post up what they say - I'd be interested to hear what effect it has on the cost of your insurance.

I have the Landcruiser insured with AMI, they have the full list of modifications and know I use it off road. Its all covered.

[wjw]

State wouldn't insure me without certified mods. I 'm now with Barley Insurance (the guys who insure the NZ4WDA) they insisit on Certs for everything too, even stuff that doesn't 'officially' require a cert, unless you PAY to get the work done by a reputable garage who they can sue if it goes wrong.

[albundy]

Sun alliance will not insure 4wd's anymore if you intend on using it as a 4wd, that's why I moved to AMI. Stupid really, what about all those shineys that use them to get to ski fields, is that not 4wdriving. AMI will cover you off road but get a clear understanding of their definition of off road. There is a $1000 excess for accidents off road. Funnily enough they do not count worsleys spur road as offraod despite being grade 4-5 track. Drowning it will incur the excess though. Bit off topic but interesting. With my certification and NZQA certificate in off road driving, my premiums stay the same.
Al

[gomulletgo]

Funnily enough they do not count worsleys spur road as offraod despite being grade 4-5 track.

wow!!! a grade 4-5 track eh? I feel pretty good about getting up that now (had to detour a couple of times) but it's good to know the sort of grade track I have been on

[dannyboy4949]

... Yeah I made enquiries today and AMI wouldnt touch the thing when I mentioned there were modification that were not certified. So I told the guy and he went down today and check the a place who certifies mod's. They said the law had changed and mod's now need to be certified - so he has booked it in tomorrow. I am phoning back AMI tonight to see what price it will cost to insure with certified mods.

Hey man, can you post up what they say - I'd be interested to hear what effect it has on the cost of your insurance.

Well to be honest they didnt really understand the whole certification process - it took about 15mins to explain. Their stance was anything uncertified - no insurance. However with a certification there was no difference in premiums between a car with certified mods and the same car no modifications. So in the end they were happy.

[nivaman]

How does one go about finding out about a vehicle that has been certed by the previous owner and you want the paper work that goes with the cert or any info about the cert?.

[Heath]

there will be an ally plate in the engine space somewhere (about150mmx200mm size) that will detail the modifications that are certified. Anything not on there isnt certified - simple.

The cost for cert is around $400 and that covers any stuff you want certified. If you have a body lift and then plan on new engine or turbo and bigger tyres, seats etc then get them done at the same time as it is all one cost. Do them seperately and you have to get a new plate, the previous mods will be rechecked and you pay another $400 each time. The cost may have changed as it was 18 months since my last one (sounds like an AA pledge).

Heath

[nivaman]

Do i ring up to obtain copies of the cert report and photos if they took any?
Is there anything else i need to know?.

[Steve_t647]

Yes you can ask for copies of the cert information from the original company that performed the certification there may be some admin cost assigned to it, also tell the certifier why you want the information (they are much happier when they know).

A friend did this and the certifier said bring it down thurs and we will have a look at it for you just bring some speights.

[xj]

To clarify:

2" spring lift does NOT require cert if the springs still use the factory mounting positions...in fact ANY spring lift does not require cert up to a lift or something rediculous like 4 meters! As long as it uses the factory spring mounts. Steve

thats fine if your only changing the springs and shocks.... but at some stage going up you need to change pannards, trailing arms etc which do need certing..... by the lvva standards anyway....

Ill go and troll their specs - brb

This PDF Document on Certification Thresholds (706K) details which level of certain modifications require LVV Certification. If the modification is not shown in this table, the vehicle does require to be certified.

http://www.lvvta.org.nz/CertThresholdSc ... il04V3.pdf

If you go straight to page 8, which speaks of steering and suspension... pannards, trailing arms, drop pitmann arms etc are not mentioned, and thus by the above quote, are required to be certed if other than factory. im fairly sure (though not an expert) that a 4mtr spring lift would need the steering parts certed!!

[Cruz]

Well its all bad now every wof place has been sent a letter stating ANY lifted vechicle MUST be cert or no wof thats from the man himself got letter from LTSA last week more PC money

[xj]

but is a letter from the man a legislative document.... then again are the lvva requirements legislative?

I have an ongoing issue with OSH (in a completley unrelated field) where the head osh cheese says one thing, but the ACOP says something else, the ACOP is the legislative document, and the OH dude is blowing smoke.....

Does anyone actually have the "legislation" ie: the legal document pertaining to all these grey areas???

[Jerry]

we had a presentation tonight from Ken Mcadam on this issue at clubnight tonight, apparantly WOF places are being urged to look out for ANY suspension mods, tyres bigger than 5% of the OEM, the catch here is that where the WOF guy may not be too clued up or let it slide the insurance co may not pay out where you have an accident and they send an assessor round

he mentioned that that this even includes putting 33"s on

[xj]

Putting 33's on in comparison to what? If the 33's arent outside of the 5% of OEM then whats the problem?

[wjw]

Putting 33's on in comparison to what? If the 33's arent outside of the 5% of OEM then whats the problem?

Trouble is they are, If I remember correctly you can legally run 32.6's on a prado

[xj]

Putting 33's on in comparison to what? If the 33's arent outside of the 5% of OEM then whats the problem?

Trouble is they are, If I remember correctly you can legally run 32.6's on a prado

Well wouldnt that be enough to rip ya undies. Alot of 33's arent 33's anyway, get out with the tape measure.....

[nivaman]

Well its all bad now every wof place has been sent a letter stating ANY lifted vechicle MUST be cert or no wof thats from the man himself got letter from LTSA last week more PC money

Even if the lifted vehicle is only lifted two inches by fitting spacers on top of the springs and a spacer on the top ball joint and no other mods?.

[SupraLux]

To clarify:

2" spring lift does NOT require cert if the springs still use the factory mounting positions...in fact ANY spring lift does not require cert up to a lift or something rediculous like 4 meters! As long as it uses the factory spring mounts. Steve

http://www.lvvta.org.nz/CertThresholdSc ... il04V3.pdf

If you go straight to page 8, which speaks of steering and suspension... pannards, trailing arms, drop pitmann arms etc are not mentioned, and thus by the above quote, are required to be certed if other than factory. im fairly sure (though not an expert) that a 4mtr spring lift would need the steering parts certed!!

Yep, I was speaking in very broad terms there... you are right of course, I was just making the point that if you use factory mounts then you were previously able to get around it - now of course thats all changing

Well its all bad now every wof place has been sent a letter stating ANY lifted vechicle MUST be cert or no wof thats from the man himself got letter from LTSA last week more PC money

Even if the lifted vehicle is only lifted two inches by fitting spacers on top of the springs and a spacer on the top ball joint and no other mods?.

spacers under balljoints = changed steering geometry = cert.

[Jerry]

Well my wof is due on Monday so will let you know what the WOF guy says about the 2" OME lift, 33" tyres ..... I'm expecting to have to get one now based on what Ken said last night.

Coupled with this new import law expected Jan next year they are looking at not allowing petrols earlier than 2002 and diesels earlier than 2004....the whole idea of the law is to reduce the amount of older vehicles in service in NZ....its going to have the complete opposite effect....not to mention increasing the prices of our older trucks.

[nivaman]

spacers under balljoints = changed steering geometry = cert.

Sorry meant the spacers are on top of the ball joint, between the upper wishbone and on top of ball joint.

[nivaman]

Found this on the ltsa website.
Raised suspension
You may have noticed a growing trend to raise vehicles. This is sometimes done by fitting a suspension or body lift kit.

These types of modifications must be LVV certified.

These modifications may affect the stability of a vehicle by changing the centre of gravity, or they may impact on the steering system. Steering and suspension geometry can also be adversely affected if a vehicle is raised significantly.

Increased tyre size can also raise a vehicle. If the tyres are outside the limits specified in the VIRM, they must be LVV certified.