Offroad-Express

I run rancho's not the best,, but thats all I can afford today on a club trip I disconected the rear staibilisers to give me more travel and for the first time I snanped a rear shock clean off,, could his been because of the disconnected rear stabisiler as when the rear wheel drops down the rear stabililer takes up the shock or am I wrong???????? Or is it old age??

Help

Graham

I think its more a Rancho problem, I've had them snap on me too.
I ran Pro Comps for 3 years with no sway bars, never had a problem, my Rancho's before that lasted 6mths, were replaced under warranty, and then promptly sold.

I'd try Koni, I'm sure the Rancho's sell for more than these, but could be wrong

I'm currently running TJM and am more then happy with them. No sway bars either. I know a few safari owners that have snapped Ranchos and my mate in Oz would never go near them again, always snapping he said.
Al

Thanks, I thought it may be the shocks, One good thing the wife is away for 2 weeks, good time to change my shocks

Graham

Graham as you know after taliking to you last week i snapped my front rancho when iwas over the coast,now i have Raw Nitro all round the front nitro's are 80series cruiser ,well happy with my setup now,did you get your lock up done and sorted??
see you Queens Bday weekend at the winch comp
Vince

Sounds like you need longer travel shocks?

You want to disconect the shocks and stabaliser bar and jack your truck up to measure your articulation against the shock travel?

Just bought and fitted a set of foam cell tuff-dogs

And Vince, Just picked a turbo manifold "new" for a 100 bucks


Graham

sounds like you ae using the shocks as travel stops. They are not designed to stop the axle going down (or up for that matter) I'm with Sadam. check your flex versus travel. Up and down.

My 2c

Rancho seem prone to this, my shocks only just allowed the coils to remain captive and the still broke, but its worth checking you had the correct length to prevent it happening again

Shock stop's ?? I have no shock stops as such front or rear and I have checked out other nissans in car yards they dont have stops they all rely on the shock as a stop

This problem is because of extreem travel required for off road use, I have thought of putting spring retainers in the rear so if it did ever happen again the spring would not fall out

I know when I broke my rear shock on the weekend I had to be carful not to bounce the rear too much other wise the rear spring would fall out, No problems with the front springs falling out as they have retainer cones but it is still the shock that stops the travel

Graham

If you retain the springs then you need to get a LVV cert.

minefield wrote: I had to be carful not to bounce the rear too much other wise the rear spring would fall out, No problems with the front springs falling out as they have retainer cones but it is still the shock that stops the travel

Graham

If your springs are in constant danger of falling out your vehicle shouldnt even be on the road at all.
Springs must be self retaining in there seats at full extension without the use of non standard devices such as wire ties , straps or external spring locators.

tallsam66 wrote:

minefield wrote: I had to be carful not to bounce the rear too much other wise the rear spring would fall out, No problems with the front springs falling out as they have retainer cones but it is still the shock that stops the travel

Graham

If your springs are in constant danger of falling out your vehicle shouldnt even be on the road at all.
Springs must be self retaining in there seats at full extension without the use of non standard devices such as wire ties , straps or external spring locators.

Unless certified?
I'm guessing the front retainer cones are the factory rubber bump stops that sit inside the top off the coil?

Sadam_Husain wrote:Sounds like you need longer travel shocks?

You want to disconect the shocks and stabaliser bar and jack your truck up to measure your articulation against the shock travel?

never had a problem with my old emu's and they where the same lenght,
Vince

DaveM wrote:

tallsam66 wrote:

minefield wrote: I had to be carful not to bounce the rear too much other wise the rear spring would fall out, No problems with the front springs falling out as they have retainer cones but it is still the shock that stops the travel

Graham

If your springs are in constant danger of falling out your vehicle shouldnt even be on the road at all.
Springs must be self retaining in there seats at full extension without the use of non standard devices such as wire ties , straps or external spring locators.

Unless certified?
I'm guessing the front retainer cones are the factory rubber bump stops that sit inside the top off the coil?

If they fall out going over a big bump you wont pass certification & frankly its a death trap.

Your right about the front bump stops, But there is no stops in the rear, And if you break a rear shock and you were on rough road yes the rear spring could fall out , There is no bump stop in the rear the rear rely's on the shock to limit the travel.

As for cirtifacation what do they know are they going to change the Nissan design, It's how they came out from new

Graham

minefield wrote:
As for cirtifacation what do they know are they going to change the Nissan design, It's how they came out from new

Graham

The designers know lots..thats why they put in a rear stabiliser bar..which has been removed & how the diff drops so low that it snaps the shocks off & the springs fall out.....think about it .
Obviously the rear stabilser bar was doing more than just stabilising.

You have hit the nail on the head, My original question was me removing the rear stabisiler bar added in me breaking the rear shock.

This is what I have been trying to find out , HAS REMOVING THE REAR STABISILER BAR BEEN THE CAUSE OF ME BREAKING THE REAR SHOCK.

Forget the fact that they were rancho's, If removing the rear stabisiler bar was the cause and I now have just put on a set of Tuff -Dogs and they were not cheap and I'm dammed if I want to break those.

I think I will reconnect my rear stabisiler bar until I find out more?????????????//

Graham

Havent broken a shock in the old Safari apart for the rancho's, that was without swaybars
How many guys run without swaybars and have no problems?

If the shocks were too short, the shocks could have been topping out too much, whereas if the shocks were long enough to just allow the coils to remain captive, there would be far less stress on it

there must be a fix to the problem Graham coz there must be shitloads of Saf's out there with suspension mods and swaybars removed?

Maybe they do rely on the shock as a stopper..... it could get expensive if thats what they all do?

I agree with the deathtrap comment, however, just pointing springs can be legally retained by other means.

I read his comment being he had to be careful the coil didn't fall out AFTER he broke the shock.

The front bump stops are only for protection against compression, and do the same as the rubber stops on th rear diff on the safari.
If you don't have rubber stops on the diff, you WILL break shocks, and probably regularly, and if you have no front swaybar, the shocks are once again limited the wheel travel, relying on the shocks internal bumpstop

Might be wrong about the rear bumpstops, memory is failing, they may be on the chassis rails, and there may be a flat plate on the rear diff for the to contact.

If you want to see how to stress out suspension, have a look at the GQ shorty in town being built. 6-8" lift, Landcruiser body/turbo motor, and no Drop Boxes, or any other noticable suspension mods to help cope with the angles

I havent run either front or rear stabilisers for years and have never broken a shock or anything else

The comments regarding not breaking shocks , what type are they running????? I have just contacted my mate in christchurch and he is running Tuf-Dogs shocks rear stabisiler disconnected for the past 5 years no problems and he has a long wheel base nissan.

I'm stuffed if I know I think I will still reconnected the stabisilers back up again just to be on the safe side

Graham

My shocks are Pro Comps, which while very popular in Oz, are just "cheap and nasty" in the states.

As mentioned, make sure your shocks are the correct length, as if the reach their travel limit well before the coil has, there would be more pressure on them, and this could have a lot to do with it

The lenght of the shocks are ok at max travel the springs are just coming loose but not sloppy

Graham

The problem with the shock breaking is caused by fitting crap quality shocks. ie Rancho! I've killed many shocks on my truck and they have all died from over heating. ie burning the valves out. I've dented shocks with rocks etc and for the entire time I've used a Safari offroad, about the last 7 years, they have both had iether a 2" or 3" lift, no swaybars, no shock limiting straps etc etc.
The need for limiting straps, is with shocks that are valved for off road racing and have very low rebound control to keep the wheels on the ground. What this means is that the speed the shock extends ie droop, is almost not controlled at all so the impact when shock reaches full travel is huge. The shocks that most of us use have equal bump and rebound valving and so the shock is not travelling anywhere near as fast once full travel is enountered so the damage is minimal. This isn't saying limiting straps don't protect normal shocks from damage, as they do, it is more saying the need is pretty minimal. My truck would get airbourne a lot more than most, which is what really stresses the shocks and I've never had one fail because of it.
You also must remember that a Safari without a lift will top out the shocks before the swaybars restrict travel so in factory setup the shocks limit the travel front and rear!
As I said at the beginning, the problem is crap Rancho shocks that are well renown for breaking the mounts. Almost any other brand is of better quality and if you use anyone of the 3 or 4 main brands that are talked about on here you'll be fine. ie OME, EFS, Tough Dog and a few others. Obviously the top brands like Koni etc will also be OK if you have the budget.

There is no mystery to Safari suspension, everything you can think of has been done before!!!!

minefield wrote:Just bought and fitted a set of foam cell tuff-dogs

And Vince, Just picked a turbo manifold "new" for a 100 bucks


Graham

Wouldnt be another one lying around would there?

Hi Vince.
I think I was at the right place at the right time, I was getting new tyres fitted when they said they have a new turbo manifold for the nissan if I was interested, Too good to turn down, I just have to find a suitable turbo to fit .

Did not see you at the winch challange??????/

Graham

minefield wrote:Hi Vince.
I think I was at the right place at the right time, I was getting new tyres fitted when they said they have a new turbo manifold for the nissan if I was interested, Too good to turn down, I just have to find a suitable turbo to fit .

Did not see you at the winch challange??????/

Graham

Vince didnt go to WC,I was going to go with him also but a last minute funds shortage sorted that for me

Mudbum = Craig

Vince's tag is = Pigfarmer

Shane