Offroad-Express

hi,
im thinking of buying a surf. im not keen on the diesels due to rediculous rego and ruc costs so i was looking at maybe a 2 litre or 2.4 litre petrol.
are these a good reliable engine? im put off the 3 litre v6 after my mates one shit itself about 3 times in as many years. first one of the heads cracked, then the big ends started knocking, then a 2nd engine cracked both heads.
im not sure if all the v6's are this bad but his was nothing but trouble and put me off a bit.
any advice on the smaller 4 cylinder petrols would be great.
cheers
weemsy

the 2 litre petrol surf's are pretty gutless

there isnt really a good petrol option in those early surf. its not unitl the 95+ shape and the 3.4 V6 that you get to a respectable motor

the 2 litre petrols are the old 3y motor, not exactly a cheap thing to run, tho it may be better with the efi. gutless as.
i've heard of but not seen a surf running the 2.4 petrol hilux motor.

later ones got the 2.7 4cyl petrol.

in all honestly small petrol motors in big 4x4's generally suck large amounts of fuel.
a holden v6 in the surf would be a better way to go.

thanks for the info.
a mate of mine has the 2.4 petrol surf and reckons its really torquey and good on fuel. but then he is trying to sell it to me so he would tell me that.
i think i will reconsider then....i dont want to offset petrol costs and loss of power against the running cost of a good diesel so i may go down the diesel path again.
any major problems to look for on the diesels? i know of head trouble but is that all across the range??
cheers
weemsy

Head problems are across the whole diesel range and still to a degree in the 1kz mostly due to getting heat away from the head, the V6 petrol has head cracking issues but usualy the right bank at the back. The 2.4 is was the first efi engine and isn't too bad (way better than my carbed 4y (2.2)). The 2.2 petrol is more powerful and better engine than the 2.8 diesel on the road but the 2.8 will chug away for a whole day and has torque from idle.

Horses for courses Petrol makes more sense with the latest RUC the cost of running a diesel (oil changes filters diesel bug treatment (if it gets in the tank) etc) is the same as petrol now but you do get better fuel economy and low down torque, the petrol is usualy better at clearing the tires (rev's higher) and is easier and more forgiving to drive on road.

The 1kz efi diesel would be the best option in diesel but you pay for the performance at the pump, if your mate still had the v6 instead of a same engine swap a Supra (2jz), holden v6 or 1uz may have been the go all very nice engines and the EFI Petrol engines are tuned for torque and power before economy but are better than the old carb.

as far as running under water the petrols don't do too bad in my book some missfires but usually gets back to normal pretty quick and mine will chug away happily on 4 or 3 under water, less scary than a diesel in water as a petrol will stall before bending something most of the time.

Ask to borrow the 2.4 so you can go for a run around in it for a day or two, fill the tank, drive it and fill it again see if you are prepared to put up with that economy, and our petrol rego will be going up min $25 too.

the head problems is mostly the 2.4 turbo. however not a problem when converted to 3L head.
a thing to watch of course with the older diesels is have they had the pump seals replaced. the 2.4's are all in the age where the seals are so-so with the low sulphur deisel.

all small deisel will have issues mostly due to poor maintance and the fact most are wound back thrashed out imports.
with the amount of small diesels you see screaming down the highway foot glued to the firewall its no wonder they chew gas then blow the heads.

running cost depends a lot on driving style, where you drive etc and amount of km's driven. diesels proberly not worth it if your doing small km's or carry little weight.

my normal driving week is 3 trips from napier to hastings a week, with a bit of running round town in between (probably about 180-200k's a week).
i get about the north island a bit, usually picking stuff up that i got on TM for my suzuki or a weekend away with my missus, although she is getting another car soon, a small petrol, so that will be used for the trips away other than 4wd'ing of course.
i know i wont be getting the economy i get with the suzuki (450 km's on $95 ), but roughly what would i be using in a 3 litre surf over 200k's around town?
cheers
weemsy

3 litre turbo diesel surf.....proberly around 12L/100km depend on if its manual, auto, modded, worn out piece of crap

has to be an auto cuz i cant use my left hand/arm (motorbike crash last year) so manual is a bit tricky
what do all these engine codes mean? 1kz 4y 3l r2d2 c3po etc etc
cheers

i can get around 550-600k out of a tank of gas, 3.0l intercooled 1kz auto
(with road tyres)

tweake wrote:3 litre turbo diesel surf.....proberly around 12L/100km depend on if its manual, auto, modded, worn out piece of crap

1kz is the 3.0 turbo diesel engine code, if you can find one of these you like it would probibly be the best bet for open road economy, you just need the leak down test and good antifreeze and normal oil changes. it is the best drivability out of the box turbo diesel in the toyota range.

tintin wrote:i can get around 550-600k out of a tank of gas, 3.0l intercooled 1kz auto
(with road tyres)

tweake wrote:3 litre turbo diesel surf.....proberly around 12L/100km depend on if its manual, auto, modded, worn out piece of crap

how much fuel to you put in when its empty ??

Weemsy wrote:has to be an auto cuz i cant use my left hand/arm (motorbike crash last year) so manual is a bit tricky
what do all these engine codes mean? 1kz 4y 3l r2d2 c3po etc etc
cheers

different series of motors. there is a list of them around for Toyota's.
L series is the older series, indirect injected, cast iron head. 2L is 2.4 litre, 3L 2.8 litre, 5L 3 litre, 2LT is 2.4 litre turbo. various version of each.
1KZ is 3 litre turbo alloy head. a couple of minor versions of it.

1KZ is the better surf motors especially with an auto. the other option is the older (cheaper) surfs with the 3L 2.8 in it. easily turbo'ed for more power and economy. or if it has a lousy 2.4 in it upgrade it to the 2.8.

Ive got a 3.0 litre turbo diesel (KZN130) automatic...i get 12.5 litres per 100km.
With the surfs...the ones with spare wheel under neath have a smaller tank than those with wheel on back door.
So only take notice of litres per 100 km.
Ive also noticed that when its due for an oil change it uses more diesel.

cheers for the info.
at least i know what im looking for when engine codes are quoted.
i think the 3 litre td are out of my price range, so i will keep an eye out for the 2.8.
there seem to be a lot more 2.4's out there than anything else. are they that bad? or just slower than the bigger capacity trucks?

weemsy

Weemsy wrote:cheers for the info.
at least i know what im looking for when engine codes are quoted.
i think the 3 litre td are out of my price range, so i will keep an eye out for the 2.8.
there seem to be a lot more 2.4's out there than anything else. are they that bad? or just slower than the bigger capacity trucks?

weemsy

of the older surfs the 2.4 turbo is the most common (not counting the even earlier 2.4 atmo surfs). the 2.8 where actually the budget model, try telling that to an ozzie and their belovered 4runners !
the 2.4 turbo's are cheap as crap. wouldn't pay anything over 2-3k for one unless its got pricy extras on it.

just thought of another thing to ask. sorry to keep asking annoying questions.......

i see a lot of surfs with i.f.s. are some of them solid front axle, or is that just the hilux??

cheers
weemsy

Weemsy wrote:just thought of another thing to ask. sorry to keep asking annoying questions.......

i see a lot of surfs with i.f.s. are some of them solid front axle, or is that just the hilux??

cheers
weemsy

i'm rusty on the years but the real early surfs where SFA (up to around 88,89) then went to IFS from then on. afaik hiluxs still had SFA for a lot longer. tho people do convert them to SFA.
remember that surfs is more of the upmarket vechile and is fitted out as such ie turbo motor, dual mass clutch, adjustable shocks etc

1984 and early 1985 surfs have solid fronts. 1985 onwards had IFS. Model code for solid front is LN60 (2.4 diesel turbo) or YN 60 (2lt petrol).
LN 61 or yn61 are IFS.

Hope that helps.

i think its a 85 model that i was looking at,
cheers for the info chaps. i know what to look for (or not!) now