Offroad-Express

G'day to all zukers!
I'm at a bit of a crossroads with the prado at the moment. It's nice enough to drive, goes pretty well offroad but after watching a bit of winch challenge action I'm thinking about getting a little more serious. A mate of mine built a soft top SJ a few years back and it was absolutely bananas with SOA, 31s, cage etc. Was a lot of fun to be in!

I'm thinking about doing the same but build to winch challenge spec after my up-coming nuptials in feb. I'd like to try and keep it roadworthy (still trailer to events though). Now I've never built or modified a vehicle myself (always had mods done by the pros) so I'll be looking for plenty tips and pointers during the build.

At the moment I'm thinking of performing a spring over, as I want to keep the body as original as possible,do a bit of protection bar work, biff on some simex or silverstones, rear/mid mount winch, dual lock, 6 point roll cage etc. Are there any issues that arise with spring over conversion and roll cages for certification? Also are there any tricks to getting the best out of the leaf suspension?

Currently have around 8 months to do the planning so hopefully can get straight into it once I find the right vehicle.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Cheers, Rhys.

those things are already pretty short narrow and tippy without doing a SOA on one, might be worth spending the time doing the resrearch and maybe looking at coils and stretching and widening the wheelbase out a bit?

I hear where your coming from but in saying that, my mate took his everywhere (bit of a nutter really, thrashed the living crap out of it!) and never lay it on its side. I think he had bigger offset rims maybe... Never even felt like it was going to tip. I hear a lot of people say they are great in rutted sections because they kind of ride only half in the ruts because of how narrow they are. Would widening the wheelbase not negate that advantage they have over bigger vehicles?
Please pardon my ignorance if i'm off the mark, have never been down this track before

Cheers, Rhys.

The biggest advantage you have in a zook is the weight.

You need to do what ever you can to preserve that advantage.

SOA in a zook is great if your into river work and deep mud, keeps the engine and associated parts high up out of the wet and crud

If your into any thing else, leave it SUA, better COG, better suspension and steering geometry.

The size of tyre you run is all relative to how rusty the wheel arches are and how much you need to cut out of them to fix the rust

Because zooks tiny little diffs, running 32's and a bit of excess steel removed from the diff housings gives you the same ground clearence as a Hilux on 36's.

You will find it will go everywhere you point it on 30 X 9.5s though. And you can keep fresh tyres on it, as the small sizes are cheap

Most of all, keep it light. As in remove stuff to make it lighter Its what gets you up the greasy hill that all the Cruisers and Patrols didn't even make it a meter up.

A few good builds are on here you could check out, DB's one is one of em. I also wouldn't go spoa after doing my research. With slightly taller springs you'll fit 31's. Mine had em on with factory springs but rubbed a tad

They are definitely the sorta vehicle a newbie mechanic can get into and work on. Mines been fully stripped and is in the process of being rebuilt and all I have are basic tools a manual and a dirt floor shed. That with asking lots of questions has kept me outta trouble so far.

Swamped wrote:They are definitely the sorta vehicle a newbie mechanic can get into and work on.

That's what I like to hear!

DieselBoy wrote:SOA in a zook is great if your into river work and deep mud, keeps the engine and associated parts high up out of the wet and crud

You will find it will go everywhere you point it on 30 X 9.5s though. And you can keep fresh tyres on it, as the small sizes are cheap

River stuff and mud is pretty much what we do around here, no real big angles . I'm looking at running 31" tyres maximum (32 at a stretch if there's a sale on haha). Not keen on virtual lift unless, as you say, it has the cancer in the arches...

Unless its been later model all I've looked at have had rust in both rear arch outer seams and passengers rear quarter behind wheel arch. Some also get it round the rear seatbelt mounts. If you gotta repair that sorta stuff just virtual lift it.

31's should fit without too much hassle. In my mind a spoa does have a few advantages with moving stuff up out of the way of rocks etc but yeah things can get tippy pretty fast and they look super hory if not done right. Would probably want to consider an anti-wrap bar if you do go down that road too?

I would just fit taller springs and shocks and be done with it. There is a mix n match combo of hiace shocks and some other vehicle that can suit it to keep cost down a bit too. Just read as much as you can.

Swamped wrote:Some also get it round the rear seatbelt mounts. If you gotta repair that sorta stuff just virtual lift it.

31's should fit without too much hassle.

I would just fit taller springs and shocks and be done with it.

I'm hoping to find a soft top but I know those aren't that easy to find at the moment . If not and it does have rusty rear seat belt mounts thinking might just cut it down anyway. Might take the advice and not worry about SOA.

Am currently humming and harring about restoring/modifying an sj vs getting vit/scudo and doing a beam conversion. Not the cheapest option but it'll be a relatively long term project so cost doesn't matter that much. Loving the suzuki builds on here at the moment so will keep looking at them and make a decision based on them.

Cheers fellas, a lot to think about!

DieselBoy wrote:The biggest advantage you have in a zook is the weight.

You need to do what ever you can to preserve that advantage.

SOA in a zook is great if your into river work and deep mud, keeps the engine and associated parts high up out of the wet and crud

If your into any thing else, leave it SUA, better COG, better suspension and steering geometry.

The size of tyre you run is all relative to how rusty the wheel arches are and how much you need to cut out of them to fix the rust

Because zooks tiny little diffs, running 32's and a bit of excess steel removed from the diff housings gives you the same ground clearence as a Hilux on 36's.

You will find it will go everywhere you point it on 30 X 9.5s though. And you can keep fresh tyres on it, as the small sizes are cheap

Most of all, keep it light. As in remove stuff to make it lighter Its what gets you up the greasy hill that all the Cruisers and Patrols didn't even make it a meter up.

What he said

Of course another way of working on the power to weight issue while keeping the COG low (although not quite the ground clearance) is to do a virtual lift, stick hilux or prado gear under it and add a SR20DET with a front drive auto and no transfer case.

Not road legal, but stable, light weight, powerful and FUN to drive

Back into planning this project now.
I've been looking on trademe for SJ's and to be honest there's not much out there. There are a few de-reg ones around though. Is it difficult (if at all possible) to get them re-vinned and re-registered due to how old they are etc? Obviously the checks would be more thorough than WOF and things would have to be perfect but it's to be a longish term project and will do it all right.

I had a sj413 SOA was very high and narrow but never rolled it Had a 1600 in it and went very well, http://www.offroadexpress.co.nz/4wds/87-sj413

Iv done a spring lift with extended shackles in my zook, cleares the 31 inch silverstones no wories, widening the stance with offset rims helps abit with the angles and it stil doesent drop right into the ruts left by the bigger trucks. As previously said make it as light as possible and they will go just about anywhere you point them with good tyres on.

Yeah I'm thinking about just going down the taller springs and shackle lift now.

RJT wrote:Is it difficult (if at all possible) to get them re-vinned and re-registered due to how old they are etc? Obviously the checks would be more thorough than WOF and things would have to be perfect but it's to be a longish term project and will do it all right.

???

You can get re-vinned, its basically just a really strict warrent, a guy from works wife works for the post office in the vtnz section and she thinks it would be fine to re-vin.
Cheers

Realy need to watch the rust in the earlier ones. Below battery mount, front and rear gaurd seams , roof gutters and the sills where they meet the front gaurds seem prone form the vehicles iv had experience with

you forgot about rust in the a pillars, rear door hinges, front body mounts/Footwell area Only thing that doesn't seem to be biodegradable is the chassis and running gear.

I think I'm starting to change my mine about the road legal requirement going by some of the comments I've read so far . I've got easy access to car trailers so I'm sure it being non road legal will be sweet! Also means no worry about having to get cert etc...

I think I'm going to steer away from the SJ idea. Was going to modify the Terrano but it's in way too good nick to think about scratching/denting it so that'll be the fishing and towing wagon. I'm currently debating whether to go with a Vitara/Escudo. Not looking at doing comps etc any more.

The revised criteria are:
Something that's relatively cheap to run hence the 1600cc
Comfortable to drive in
Not as rusty as SJ's
Easy to work on myself
Road legal (if there are long distances to trips I can tow with the Terrano). A WOF'able one to start off with would be ideal and take it off the road, build it slowly and build it right first time with cert etc. Usure on LWB/SWB, manual/auto at the moment.

I've just started looking into parts.
Does anybody run this suspension lift kit?
http://www.winch.co.nz/categories/fts-s ... n-lift-kit
If so how does it perform and what is the quality of the kit like as I've heard horrible things about the Calmini kit. Would be looking at running 31" tyres max with rear air locker and a featherweight right foot 90% of the time. Opinions?

theres a road leagl 4wd comp just started in the north island and am seeking a v6 vitara and doing a lift like this
havent really heard anyone rav about calmani kits but figured there would be others out there
this kit is on for the 1.6 models
is the transfercase different to the v6
and is this available road legal in nz

http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/used-cars/suzuki/sj413/auction-444497094.htm

http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/used-cars/suzuki/sj413/auction-442551252.htm

There's a couple reasonable examples of SJs. I just think you'd find them a heck of a lot cheaper, lighter and easier to work on than a vitara

http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/used-cars/suzuki/vitara/auction-443707902.htm
Otherwise, thats a pretty good condition vitara. its getting really hard to find anything in half decent condition.

Have you started working out the cost of all your mods yet?

Can't check out the tradme links at work but will look later. I've noticed it's easier to get a cheap, WOF/REG, ok cond vitara/escudo than it is an SJ in same cond. Have started adding up and it's come under $4k so far, though mod price doesn't matter as much as it's a going to be a ">year long project" .

RJT wrote:Can't check out the tradme links at work but will look later. I've noticed it's easier to get a cheap, WOF/REG, ok cond vitara/escudo than it is an SJ in same cond. Have started adding up and it's come under $4k so far, though mod price doesn't matter as much as it's a going to be a ">year long project" .

All good. it starts to add up really fast haha. I did a basic setup on my SJ and its gone way over 4k, once you start to add in the additional things like gears, bumpers, flares, exhaust, etc

I had an LJ78 Prado until late last year and it was pretty well set up (lift, front bar, winch, 33's, locker, snorkel, hooks, comms etc) and spent about $7-8k on it so I know all about the cost of setting up a vehicle. This one won't be as modified and I'll do as much of the work as I can, as a fair amount of the cost of getting the Prado done was labour. Part of the project is also for the learning aspect.