Offroad-Express

So I have noticed recently when I start up my wagon and the heat setting for the heater is anywhere above cold bubbles can be heard flowing through the system. If I let it settle and then turn the heater to cold for a while and then put it back to hot more bubbles can be heard.

Radiator overflow bottle looks okay, radiator level is okay and its never got hot (or even close - 91 is as high as I have had it go and I watch EGT as well) so whats the deal?

Am I looking at a simple air lock some where or is it more sinister and likely to be a head gasket? No smoke being blown of any colour except a pale black if I give it the right foot hard.

Its a prado 1KZ-TE diesel turbo (intercooled) if that helps. Got a service due so might get a check done for exhaust gases in the radiator fluid (if they can do one), get them to bleed the system and then test it.

On long runs the temp sits around 87-89 deg C and with the trailer at 90-91.

Just after possible issues so I can check them off as I go.

Cheers,

Heath

don't forget heater core split - had a v6 camry that took a cooked motor before I found it

whats the symptoms of split core? Never heard of that one before.

If the heater core is leaking you can get a hot antifreeze smell and its humid so to speak when its on hot mode.
I would get the system pressure tested and see if the pressure decays.
Could be any number of things
Loose hose clip, split hose, corroded connections, cracked head, cracked cores, faulty radiator cap.

Might get new hoses fitted this service just to get that possibility removed. will get a pressure test done too I think.

Lets look at it this way, you have a 1kzte, they are blasted for cracking heads, you have a cooling system problem.

Id be getting it checked sooner rather than later, by means of atleast a pressure test.

Cheers Daniel

Well at best its just the gasket and worst its the head.

BUGGER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

1.5-3K to get it sorted (1.5 if just gasket - 3 if head)
Not happy, I dont thrash it, service it regularly and now it does this to me. I realise its age means its due for "issues" so cant complain too much I guess.

So options for a new head. Is there an aftermarket one that sorts the crack issues or am I best just going OEM (not keen on a cheaper chinese one).

What else should I doo while its off?

Water pump is on the cards anyway maybe getting the radiator checked/rodded/replaced.

Get a genuine head ..... they are cheap enough

While its off.
De Gunk intake, remove EGR system, get the injectors seen too.

New injectors 10K ago, intake degunk on the plan, EGR being blanked off (definately) / removed (maybe), New water pump (just in case and just because).

Radiator going to stay as is for now (might get it checked ) but next service I will get it rodded/swapped (we'll see what the final cost is going to be first) and the viscus fan hub will be upgraded too (going to do that one myself - maybe...).

I'm going to put a new head in while the old one is off. Figure that the old one is at the age they tend to go so why waste extra money later on doing the swap. Bit of financial hurt now rather than doing it all again later. I'll get the old one checked and if its okay will flog it off to offset the costs a little (bung it on Trade me - someone will want one to fix up a truck before they move it on...).

Hopefully this will breathe some life into the beast and maybe be the answer to my Kms/Lt dropping.

Was going to get the new boost gauge fitted, get the a new thingee to control boost (tweake things a little) and finally do the dump pipe, but that will all have to wait now. Well all but the gauge because I already have that, just have to find the cutting disks for my dremel and figure out where to install it.

Such is life I guess.

You wont get too much more boost out of her as it has a cut out at 14psi give or take.

Hoping just to make sure the waste gate doesnt creep open before its time (pressure) and maybe I'll tweek it a touch...only upto where it should be nothing more. Okay maybe a little more.

Any one used these guys for heads?

http://www.kiwicylinderheads.com/

Do they buy in or make their heads?

Go and buy a toyota original... They are not that badly priced.
I paid $800 for mine 6 ish years ago when mine went.
Total job (doing it myself and outsourcing the machining and injectors) cost me under 2k..All the little bits add up.
Cheaper than the 3 to 5 k I was quoted at the time....
There are some aftermarket knockoffs out there.

Yeah, just checking options I guess.

Should I get the injectors checked while they are out too? Just had them done (okay it was 20K ago or there abouts), but is it worth checking them again before putting them in a new head?

Just worried about spending too much on stuff I dont need to worry about and not spending on stuff I should be...

So the head came off and the gasket was fine. So it must be the head, not thats fine too (have to get it checked further later). Put it all back together with a new head and gasket etc (just in case).

Start it up to come home and guess what...F"ing bubbles in the heater still.

So I am really angry (3plus Gs down the drain and its still not fixed), actually angry doesnt cover it and the missus is well lets just say she isnt happy with me spending money we didnt have and we have to spend more yet...

They said they saw some water in the turbo when they took the bits off (and assumed it was from some they had spilled in there.

Could it be that a seal in the turbo has gone between the watercooling and the air pressure is pushing into the cooling system?

At least on the plus side it appears I have a good head to sell and the EGR stuff is blocked off and the intake cleaned of all the gunk. Temps are up on EGT about 10 Degrees C and water temp is up about 4 degrees. I am guessing this may be the result of the EGR system being blocked so more air=more burn=more heat (both in water temp and EGT). The old thermostat was left in place asit wasnt deemed a problem so the only change is the air cleanliness (no egr gases) and flow (clean intake).

So HELP me please with options/ideas and who is the turbo guy to go to in Chch if that is the problem?

Anyone want to donate to the Prado fund cause this is getting bloody expensive now.

unless the guy wgho did it is a really good friend, take it back and throw your toys until they fix it. They are the professional who has just charged you 3k and need to sort it out.

rangimotors wrote:unless the guy wgho did it is a really good friend, take it back and throw your toys until they fix it. They are the professional who has just charged you 3k and need to sort it out.

Couldnt agree more, im in the trade, and id fully expect somthing to come back like that. TAKE IT BACK AND THROW YOUR TOYS.

Cheers Daniel

jarrod at turbocare is the man to see. but if the turbo water seal was gone you would be getting water going out the turbo? and loosing water? plus if air was getting thru turbo seals would the coolant system not pressurise?

Pressure test the system.........and look for leaks.

When mine cracked a head.
It was obvious it was the head as #2 cylinder was very clean...Steam cleaned.
I would have thought as a minimum the head would have been cleaned and pressure tested or crack checked.

Not having much luck are yah

Chin up.....you could always drop in a V6....

not sure i this helps

When the car is running you can hear bubbles flowing through the heater core, (like a fish tank) this is due to air becoming trapped inside the heater core, in time the air should dissipate to silence the noise.

http://www.2carpros.com/articles/how-a-car-heater-works


http://www.toyota-supra.info/forums/mki ... bbles.html

Before the fix the bubbles could only be heard occasionally and now its throughout the rev range and at 2000rpm its almost a constant stream of bubbles.

The guy who did the work is an friend of the family (I went to school with his sister and my parents were good friends with theirs) from way back so its difficult.

Its a prick because all the signs were a leak somewhere (head or gasket) and this seemed like the right course of action. I even suggested a new head while it was off just for my piece of mind too and he agreed it was probably the best idea with the age of my engine, etc.

If it was just the heater needing burping then I'll be really pissed but how do I prove it now the system has been drained and refilled. They could argue that it didnt need it before but does now.

I do feel a bit buggered here and throwing my toys out the cot may happen but i'd rather not.

At the end of the day I need to find out what the problem was/is and get it sorted. This has only happened since we had the really cold weather snap (snow etc) and my wagon lives outside for now. Is it possible the feeds to the turbo froze and buggered the seals? There was some pressurising of the system before the fix and I'll have to check it later to see if there still is. I never lost water in the rad, no white smoke, no empty overflow bottle etc.

I think a leak test will be on the cards before we move on. I had one done when I did the injectors and it held at the pressure they put in for over an hour before they let it off. They said it was quite impressive for a 1kz engine.

I guess how do I prove anything, my word against theirs.

it wont be air coming from the turbo asthe water jacket is completly seperate from the rest of the turbo. If it was you'd have blown the motor by now.so You can cross that off the list.

Are you sure its a leak? I take it it does itwith the fan off? It could be something else but coming from the same area. Try disconnecting the hoses and take it for a drive and see if it still does it.

Hope this helps.know how frustrating these things can be!

Maybe its time to bypass the heater and see if it still does it. Then you can start eliminating things.

Cheers Daniel

If i switch the heater to cold (shutting the coolant flow) the sound of bubbles stops but as soon as I open the valve (turn to hot) the bubbles return and in a huge flurry at first before settling down to a constant stream.

Could I have a hose loose that is allowing a venturi to occur? I would think this unlikely as the system is pressurised when running so water should spurt out instead of drawing air in.

Its now worse than before (constant) so something they have done has made it worse.

I'll have a chat to Rick (and a few mechanics I know in Auckland when I can) and see what he thinks today while I am in town.

Ithink a simple pressure test might be on the cards (hot and cold).

id try bypassing the heater control valve.
sounds like air is being drawn in through the valve its self in a venturi action.
pressure in the system would be closing the seal lip and stoppping water leaking out.

my 2c.

How do you usually bleed the system?

In my old surf the heater control valve and associated hoses going through the firewall were the highest point in the system, so I would undo one of these and use them to fill the system also. I would then leave the rad cap off overnight after running the motor a bit to get the bulk of the air out.

It would usually take a couple days of top ups to get all the air out.

Jack the front up on blocks ramps or in my current case a huge pile of dirt. Take the cap off and run the engine on high idle until the thermostat opens then rev it to get the waterflow to drag the bubbles of air through to the radiator (which in theory should be the highest point), topping up as I go. Then cap back on and top up the rad overflow bottle.

Going to do this a few times over the weekend and see how it goes. With any luck once its bled properly it should be fine. If after all this it still has bubbles moving through the system then we go on to the next step (not sure what that is yet).

Thought maybe if the head was okay it may have a faulty radiator cap and it is allowing air in rather than sucking water from the overflow. went to Toyots today to get a genuine cap, gave them the vehicle type, engine type and recieved a radiator cap. Got home and its the wrong one - ARSE!!! now have to go back, thought I was dealing with toyota not Repco...

Temps seem to settle around the 88 deg C during the day (at 100km) and about 4 deg lower at night. Might have to keep an eye on that as we head into summer. I can see a refurb of the viscus hub coming up (didnt feel tight after a long run home last night (morning)).

Correct me if I am wrong but when the vehicle reaches operating temp the hub should lock up a little and be hard to turn (mines not that hard to turn - has some resistance though).

Had a chat today with the garage and we will sort the issues as we go and he has assured me if they have done something wrong I will not be out of pocket - nice to hear.

So chin up and smile for me for now...

as above with the heater on hot to bleed the air out of the heater system/lines as well.