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Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Sun May 05, 2013 8:33 am
by suzukisport
Hey guys,
Just wanting to get peoples thoughts on what an RB26DETT would be like in an off roader. Doesn't seam to be a common conversion and I can't find much info about it.
I would be wanting to know what autos can be used on these motors to adapt to a transfer case.
Anyone with some info on this would be great to here from.
Cheers
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Sun May 05, 2013 9:09 am
by Dirtydog
Heres some info that will be usefull, its a rb25det but same sort of thing.
http://www.offroadexpress.co.nz/Forums/ ... 25&t=30631If you would like some measurements of a safari auto i can get them for you,
I have a spare one laying around, i dont know if they bolt up or anything but who knows.
Some usefull information is that the terrano auto boxes will take a safari transfer case on the back with little effort, and vice versa (giving the option of drivers side or passengers side driveshaft)
If you cant find anything to work you could allways run a divorced transfer case from the original auto.
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Sun May 05, 2013 10:21 am
by Crash bandicoot
You can fit one of these into a 1985 hilux onwards...just.
In saying that parts availability are getting scarce. They stopped making the RB in 1998.
You are better off with a RB30 block from a 1987 holden commodore
A Rb25 non turbo head from a R32 or R33(89 to mid 93) nissan skyline, laurel or cefiro.
Get it P&P'd and the compression raised.
With a set of extractors(pit stop) and an Air flow meter from a 1995 nissan Maxima V6 3 L and put an extra inline fuel pump in from a VL commodore you are good for 260 KW at the wheels with all standard nissan ECU etc and more reliable.
Yes people say oh turbo hp torque, but there's nothing more rock solid then a tickled up N/A RB
If you are lucky enough to get your hands on a RB25 head from the 1993 onwards skyline it has Variable cam and can hit 9000 RPM s as apposed to the standard twin cam that will do around 7800/8200 rpm.
And then there is the price. you can pick up a good RB30 block for around 500, a N/A twin cam head setup from gary at nisbits in takanini for around the same that includes manifolds and loom/ecu, the Maxima AFM will set you back anywhere from 120 for second hand to 250-300 for a brand new one.
It cost me 980 dollars to fully strip down my twin cam head and get it the full works. it would out pull and out run a standard RB25det after that.
that was at wanganui engine rebuilders.
and around 300 in gaskets and head bolts etc from partmaster.
use RB25 head bolts.
you will need the cambelt from a twin cam mazda diesel engine(more teeth)
you will need a good 10.5 mm drill bit and a tap and die set to relocate the cam belt idler pulley.
IF you cat the VVT head you will need to tig weld up the very small oil gallery in the right hand front corner of the head..this is the oil feed for the VVT which the older RB30 doesn't cater for. you then drill and tap a fitting into the side of the head to the same gallery and run a 1/4 inch hose from there down to a T on the oil pressure sender unit under the intake manifold.
If you reckon that is a bit of you it is much cheaper then trying to get your hands on a good RB26dett that hasn't had the sh*t thrashed out of it and even after all the above still cheaper to build and cheaper to repair.
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Sun May 05, 2013 10:25 am
by Crash bandicoot
The benefit to this is also you can(if you don mind auto) just bolt a terrano/mistral transfer case to the back of a skyline transmission(same box) much easier then trying to mate up differing brands.
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Sun May 05, 2013 11:37 am
by onebadman
be a dead simple conversion to a safari as they came out with rb30e so hunt out the mounts off one of them and your away singing and as for the 25 26 debate can get just as good results from a 25 compared to a 26 and if your going to spend the extra expence of a 26 consider building a rb30det for the extra torque
no replacement for displacement
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Sun May 05, 2013 1:28 pm
by wax
Use the rb25 head it has hydraulic lifters much better in the situtation your wanting to do and there isnt really alot of performance difference between the heads. its the bolt on that make the difference to these engines. Build an rb30det and you will scare your self
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Sun May 05, 2013 2:56 pm
by Dirtydog
there is another option if your looking at getting decent figures out of an N/A engine, and thats the vh41.
Theyre pretty cheap, in most cases you can get a complete engine, loom, ecu etc plus auto for about 1.5k
Heres the specs of the engines (from wikipediea)
RB26dett: 280 hp (206 kW) @ 6800 rpm and 260 lb·ft (353 Nm) @ 4400 rpm
VH41de: 268 hp (200 kW) at 5600 rpm and 278 lb·ft (377 N·m) @ 4000 rpm
Slap a turbo on that, with the valve springs from a twin turbo VG30 and you have even more power.
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Sun May 05, 2013 4:37 pm
by Crash bandicoot
copy of PM for the benefit of any one wanting to do the RB conversion
They are easy to make. you will have to cut the original mounts off at the chassi rails, not only are they in the wrong place the torque from the straight six will rip them clean off the chassi rails.
get a piece of pipe with the internal diameter the same size as the bolt the holds the engine mount to the rail. get two bits of flat plate 5 ml thick one 60mm by 30 mm and the other 60mm by 90mm then two pieces triangle shaped that will go on the sides. the point of the triangle is where the pipe will be be welded parrellel to the chassis. this will allow the factory nissan mount to bolt striaght to it.
Do this for both sides. and set the pieces aside.
also you will need to get a flat plate 8mm thick 100 by 100 mm for the gearbox mount... use the nissan/commodore gearbox mount drill a hole in the flat plate where you see fit. and bolt it to the mount side that would normally rest on the crossmember.
now bolt your box and engine together and get it in the engine bay.(used a rb25 de clutch and pressure plate(Rb30 although bigger capacity is actually smaller then the later RB25de)
you will need to lift the front of the truck up for this aswell as using an engine crane to swing the gearbox in under the tunnel.
the key to positioning the engine and gearbox is the steering rack. the sump needs to clear this. it will fit but needs to be based on this calculation.
You will see the flat plate on the gearbox mount now rests on the hilux crossmember. center it and mark the plate and the crossmember.
Now center the engine. a good guide to this is the top of the plenum chamber is level not the cam covers. once level measure the center of the crank pulley to the inside edge of each chassi rail and the same with the out put shaft of the gearbox.if you look closely at a nissan skyline engine bay you will notice the engine slants to the left but the plenum chamber is level.
get some steel and wood blocks and rest it over the engine bay of the lux and using two ratchet strops(1 either side) tie the engine to it like a gantry.
release the load of the engine crane so the suspension of the truck takes the full wieght of its new power train. you can now see how much room there is between the sump and the steering. you can use the ratchets to adjust the height of the engine if need be...
once centered and the plenum is level you should have around 15mm of space between the engine and the firewall.
once happy with the location of the engine /gearbox you can weld the flat plate on the gearbox mount to the hilux crossmember and build the engine mounts to suit.
mine got certed with 15mm clearance at full lock but had to bolt a plate the the crossmember under the engine that came up to the sump closer then 15mm in the event an engine mount failed it wouldn't jam the steering arm.
You will need the bonnet from a early V6 surf to clear the nissans cambelt cover.
you will need to use a electric fan as there is no room for the viscus hub on the RB take it off. bolt the water pump pulley back on and grind the studs and shaft of the water pump off flush with the pulley. also use the nissan radiator.
if you chose to go 5 speed manual the shaft of the VL when cut off slides nice and tight inside the shaft of the hilux with no balancing needed. just weld right around the join..... you will have to grind the balancing wieghts of the VL shaft as that how tight a fit it is.
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Sun May 05, 2013 4:50 pm
by Crash bandicoot
and one more thing. if you are wondering where to put the steel oil line from the left hand side of the head. the RB30 has a unused bung in the bottom of the block that drains to the sump..the aforementioned oil line is the drain back for the VVT.
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Sun May 05, 2013 8:12 pm
by slide
suzukisport wrote:Hey guys,
Just wanting to get peoples thoughts on what an RB26DETT would be like in an off roader.
I would be wanting to know what autos can be used on these motors to adapt to a transfer case.
What sort of offroader we talking here? I don't think a 26 is gunna be the best for rockcrawling, but for a trophy truck style racer- yea boi!
Mega loads of rb26dett information out there, try search skyline forums etc.
Auto box will be easy, pretty much any 4x4 box will bolt up, just use a rwd rb(20/25) bellhousing to suit.
However I would suggest the bigger RE4R03A will hold the power better than the smaller RE4R01A.
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Sun May 05, 2013 8:44 pm
by Crash bandicoot
slide wrote:suzukisport wrote:Hey guys,
Just wanting to get peoples thoughts on what an RB26DETT would be like in an off roader.
I would be wanting to know what autos can be used on these motors to adapt to a transfer case.
What sort of offroader we talking here? I don't think a 26 is gunna be the best for rockcrawling, but for a trophy truck style racer- yea boi!
Mega loads of rb26dett information out there, try search skyline forums etc.
Auto box will be easy, pretty much any 4x4 box will bolt up, just use a rwd rb(20/25) bellhousing to suit.
However I would suggest the bigger RE4R03A will hold the power better than the smaller RE4R01A.
i am aware its for a 2wd hilux.
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Sun May 05, 2013 9:00 pm
by wax
The gearbox is the easiest part. Use a v6 gearbox and unbolt the front half of the gearbox and use the rb front half. Its a bolt on and then the drive-shafts and the rear gearbox mount are all done.
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Sun May 05, 2013 10:01 pm
by suzukisport
Thanks for all the reply's.
Just toying with the idea of using one of these engines to be a little different.
Plans would be to use it for offroad racing and also winch comps. Would want something that would be good and reliable with some decent power.
Just really scheming here to see really its worth the money or better off sticking to something that people know work well.
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Sun May 05, 2013 11:40 pm
by wax
The rb30det will work awesome there low down grunt is impressive.
Heck if you need more low down then put lower diffs in it
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Mon May 06, 2013 6:18 pm
by Crash bandicoot
wax wrote:The rb30det will work awesome there low down grunt is impressive.
Heck if you need more low down then put lower diffs in it
the other side of the coin being with a RB30det does one really need low range?

Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Mon May 06, 2013 6:24 pm
by wax
Crash bandicoot wrote:wax wrote:The rb30det will work awesome there low down grunt is impressive.
Heck if you need more low down then put lower diffs in it
the other side of the coin being with a RB30det does one really need low range?

Where is the like button
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Mon May 06, 2013 6:30 pm
by Trundle
The r32 26 are crap , have short cranks and crack oil pumps ,
the 33 motor is better solid lifter , long crank but crack the top of blocks still ,
your best bang for buck is a r34 neo rb25det , long crank , semi forged pistons , r33 gtr rods factory and can make 380rwkw on e85 or 350kw on pump ,
considering the neo 34 25det is only 2k , why would you spend 5k on a 26 that you have to convert the 4wd sump also the twin turbos are very averige, when you could spend the money and upgrade injectors fuel pump , and do a sinco manifold and uprated turbo , and piss out 300 plus kw ,
As for the rb30 with the 25det head ,unless you have built them before , and know how to make the oil returns , correct size restrictors , you are wasting your time , the 30's have no legs and i wouldnt reccomend revving them past 6200 if turboed ,
dont get me wrong there good but only if you want to spend 10k plus on a long engine ,
I have owned off roaders with rb30's and multiple drift cars with 25's also have a lot of customers with turbo 25's, 26's and 30 turbos ,
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Mon May 06, 2013 7:12 pm
by Crash bandicoot
Trundle wrote:The r32 26 are crap , have short cranks and crack oil pumps ,
the 33 motor is better solid lifter , long crank but crack the top of blocks still ,
your best bang for buck is a r34 neo rb25det , long crank , semi forged pistons , r33 gtr rods factory and can make 380rwkw on e85 or 350kw on pump ,
considering the neo 34 25det is only 2k , why would you spend 5k on a 26 that you have to convert the 4wd sump also the twin turbos are very averige, when you could spend the money and upgrade injectors fuel pump , and do a sinco manifold and uprated turbo , and piss out 300 plus kw ,
As for the rb30 with the 25det head ,unless you have built them before , and know how to make the oil returns , correct size restrictors , you are wasting your time , the 30's have no legs and i wouldnt reccomend revving them past 6200 if turboed ,
dont get me wrong there good but only if you want to spend 10k plus on a long engine ,
I have owned off roaders with rb30's and multiple drift cars with 25's also have a lot of customers with turbo 25's, 26's and 30 turbos ,
1. Your point on soild lifters in the R32 series is irrelevent. No early twin cam RB had hydraulic lifters. only the series 2 R33 onwards.
2. your point on a Neo rb25 is also irrelevent as they will go into R&R at sustained rpm and cook the coil packs. which in an off road environment with little air flow around the motor and high rom in mud holes and hill climbing at low speed will envoke R&R. This is negated by using a standard series 1 R33 RB25 loom ecu and VG30de pink sticker AFM with that addition of the aforemention change to the VVT oil feed system when using the RB30 block.
3. If using a non SAS vehicle you will need the 4wd sump and change the viscous diff head to a standard. (which will need to be done anyway as it will not work without the 4wd ecu from the donor car.)
other wise an rwd RB sump is fine.
4. removing the electronic restrictions will get you more then enough power safley without having to change injectors and the like. if you read the thread you grasp why a VG30de AFM is required to tell the ecu to increase the fuel to match the larger capacity block.
5.You seem to not realise that the RB30 came turbo charged as well. all the necessary drain backs and gallery's are present for turbo charging. the drain back is on the centre left of the block and the oil and water line feeds are under the intake manifold on the block.
the reference to 6200 rpm is negated as the restriction there was to do with the single cam head rockers and valve train damage. nothing to do with the bottom end. this is null and void with the addition of the Rb25 twin cam head.
You say here you have owned and know people with differing combinations of RB's if so you would know these details intricately.
here is my Rb30det done in my car shed in one weekend with some mates and some beer. It is people like you that scare people of giving things ago for themselves.

Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Mon May 06, 2013 8:04 pm
by wax
Trundle wrote:The r32 26 are crap , have short cranks and crack oil pumps ,
the 33 motor is better solid lifter , long crank but crack the top of blocks still ,
your best bang for buck is a r34 neo rb25det , long crank , semi forged pistons , r33 gtr rods factory and can make 380rwkw on e85 or 350kw on pump ,
considering the neo 34 25det is only 2k , why would you spend 5k on a 26 that you have to convert the 4wd sump also the twin turbos are very averige, when you could spend the money and upgrade injectors fuel pump , and do a sinco manifold and uprated turbo , and piss out 300 plus kw ,
As for the rb30 with the 25det head ,unless you have built them before , and know how to make the oil returns , correct size restrictors , you are wasting your time , the 30's have no legs and i wouldnt reccomend revving them past 6200 if turboed ,
dont get me wrong there good but only if you want to spend 10k plus on a long engine ,
I have owned off roaders with rb30's and multiple drift cars with 25's also have a lot of customers with turbo 25's, 26's and 30 turbos ,
Wow rips (rotorua import) may disagree with you over that 6200 rpm rev limit.
The main reason that these engines break oil pumps is due to drifters smashing them off the rev limiter, if you tune it to fall over up at the top and move the rev limiter higher, like a soft cut. You will find that the pump is just fine.
This will make some good reading for you
http://stevenwelsh.site.net.au/RB30_DOHC.pdf
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 6:00 pm
by Crash bandicoot
i was going to mention Robbie at RIPS Wax, but his work is another level up beyond what any of us blokes are used too.

Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 6:17 pm
by wax
I spoke to him alot when I was building my rb30/26
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 10:09 pm
by Trundle
Firstly i was only saying a rb30 is more for people with more mechanical knowledge and funds to make it work efficiently i.e not just bolt it in and go ,
You can't tell me that its ONLY the rev limiter yes this is a contributing factor but have you seen the contact between a std 30de crank and the oil pump ?also with the long stroke of the 30 un ballanced it is not advized to go past these revs ,and yes it CAN be rectified via using a 25det oil pump and machining a crank collar but hell why wouldnt you spend 2k on a late model neo that has that factory,
As far as your comments regarding swapping air flow meters , i would strongly reccomend using a map sensed computer such as link etc as the hot wire afm;s are beyond shit in nissans period . . .
The coil packs are also SHIT in al rb;s and the single cam dizzy also plaugued with ignitor issues etc which can be rectified using quality coils such as splitfire etc ,
As far as your comment regarding the oil feeds etc i was talking about internal ones to the cylinder head , not the feed and drains for the turbo i.e blocking one of the galleries , running a restrictor in the other , i also fabricate an a/n fitting and press it into the back of the head and drain it into the bottom of the block to remove the excess oil from the cylinder heads caused by running high revs for prolonged periods of time when not using a dry sump , also using an open breather system with a return to the sump ,
As for the knowing these sytems intricatly, Your sarcastic attack,
There is no need to be a keyboard warrior ,
My advise is based on having run customers cars for over a decade with nissan rb in all aspects of motorsport , D1nz , gtrnz, street sprints , and rally ,
And is only my reccomendation ,
Also i am definatly not mocking Robbie Ward , he is possibly one of the best advocates for drag racing in nz and the nissan rb motor ,
Before you start attacking people like your the BOSS mechanic , you better up your game , I was almost insulted untill i saw the spec of you engine bay ,
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 10:17 pm
by Trundle
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Tue May 07, 2013 11:46 pm
by wax
Ok Im out. I cant be bothered getting into a argument online.
Re: Thoughts on RB26DETT
Posted: Wed May 08, 2013 10:28 am
by turoa