Offroad-Express

Hi all my name is Dave I live in chch .am new to the forum my mate gave me the link as he's been on it for years . Although I've been offroading a lot on.weekends etc I entered the mainland winch challenge with my mate at chch recently as his navi and am absolutely hooked now .so have decided to enter next year hopefully( if I can get my truck up to spec. ) lol. I have an ln 130 hilux 2.8 I know it's not everyone's first or possibly last choice at that for comps but she's a good old girl and never lets me down and can't part with her.I am looking at running 35s on her with cruiser diffs and beams but not sure what ratio will work best with it being a 2.8 . Am not worried about high end road speed just plenty of grunt to turn the 35s in mud etc. If anyone has any words of wisdom it would be greatly appreciated cheers all dave

Hi,
Wondering why you are going to go to the effort of putting Cruiser diffs in if you are going to stick the 2.8 diesel. Will lose ground clearance and will cost time and money that I would have thought would be better spent on making your truck more capable and reliable such as lockers and axles and CV's.
Cheers
Tim

Is it a surf or hilux? ln130 is a surf, it's its a hilux then it will already have solid front end.

If so, as suzolla said, strengthen the drive train, slap a turbo on off a 2.4, shave the diff housings when you pull the diff's out to fit auto lockers, and ur away, don't let anyone tell you the hilux diff's won't do. They are fine.

Its the whole cost:benefit thing as well.

Stock for stock the LandCruiser units are the stronger overall units by quite a considerable margin (FJ80 front aside)

The 8" Hilux can achieve the best strength:packaging/size ratio but that involves considerable expense/time in upgrading all of the internals.

Plus there is probably a track width advantage.

However the 60/70 Series seem to have comparably high stock gear ratios.

Cheers for the reply guys my only thinking for cruiser diffs was to beef everything up ? Will be putting lockers on etc n all and as it's a surf am converting the front to solid beam anyways . Just don't want to be the dude that breaks down on the track coz I blew my stock diff imagine it haha. I know I'd lose a wee bit of clearance but I'll be driving .my navi can winch me out. Lol... But seriously this is why I'm on the forum because any knowledge that's out there will help me out no end am not starting build until Xmas hols so every bit of input is going to go a long way . You mentioned slapping a 2.4 turbo on it are there any tricks of the trade ie modifications that can be done only reason I've asked is I know a few guys that had done it and blown the head on the 2.8 Am super keen for the turbo to get some more power out of the old girl are there any mods to keep the 2.8 reliable with a turbo.

Cheers for that will look into 60/70 series

im running 35's silverstones on my hilux diffs no issues so far got 4.88's with the commy v6 more ratios are good enough bogs are 2nd low is heaps to clear the dirt and still have good speed. goes further in the boggy stuff then stuff with bigger diffs turbo safaris. but that also comes down to a lot of different factors wheel base and power to weight ratio...

Yep i'm the one who suggested cruiser diffs Because its not a Cruiser I don't know to much about it
Its an IFS Surf so that's why we talked about doing the SAS (solid axle swap). I may have got confused but I was told the 8" diffs in the landcruiser/prado had stronger internals?? We have fairly easy access to 9.5 inch cruiser diffs so its also a budget consideration
It already has coils in the back so what would he need to change there to run 35s on it?
Will make sure we post pics as things progress. Any constructive advice will be gratefully accepted

Oops My post wasn't specific enough , I was referring to the FJ60 units from my experience, mostly the steer axle.
And the whole concept of just putting an axle that size in a much lighter vehicle, ie. strength bang for buck at the trade off of some clearance.

I also see the logic of just keeping the standard rear and putting a matching width Bundera/Prado axle in

Keep surf rear diff in with 3inch lift, find a hilux or prado front diff for front, go coil overs if you can afford to otherwise coil and shocks, lockers 2inch body lift chromolly axles and your away laughing

Thats what i did to mine anyway, also have to do ifs hub swap or spacers on front as ifs diffs wee bit wider than hilux solid axle, as for 2.8 put turbo off 2.4 dont run huge power and make sure you intercool it you will be fine

I was referring to the FJ60 units from my experience, mostly the steer axle.
And the whole concept of just putting an axle that size in a much lighter vehicle, ie. strength bang for buck at the trade off of some clearance.

As far as I am aware ( could be wrong) the only real part that is stronger on the FJ60 compared to Hilux is the diff head, axles, CV's, swivel housings, spindles and steering is pretty much the same. The 60 series does give you the advantage of a bit of extra width.

One problem with the LJ7? and KZJ7? is the axle lengths are different to the Hilux, FJ40, FJ60 and FJ70 and so stronger after market axles such as Longfield were not available, I had a batch of custom ones made by Longfield and have a couple left if required, I think they may be available now but have not confirmed yet.

Cheers
Tim

Kz and lj cv and axles of the front axles are same as hilux ones...

suzolla wrote:

I was referring to the FJ60 units from my experience, mostly the steer axle.
And the whole concept of just putting an axle that size in a much lighter vehicle, ie. strength bang for buck at the trade off of some clearance.

As far as I am aware ( could be wrong) the only real part that is stronger on the FJ60 compared to Hilux is the diff head, axles, CV's, swivel housings, spindles and steering is pretty much the same. The 60 series does give you the advantage of a bit of extra width.

Most certainly concur regarding CVs etc.

I had a musing that due to the extended width, the longer inner axle may have more twist than the Hilux one and therefore have a higher breakage point. Then I realised that this would be so neglible that it was a completely bullshit argument.

Good solid differential center though.

I recall this particular 60 had an extra truss on the front diff case from the factory.

I have no experience with the Prado/Bundera front axle but am told that it shares the same diff center as the FJ80. I'm not sure if this is accurate.

lax2wlg wrote:I have no experience with the Prado/Bundera front axle but am told that it shares the same diff center as the FJ80. I'm not sure if this is accurate.

I'd happily say that they use the exact same high pinion front 8" diff. The ratios would possibly be different between the models, but that's an easy fix.

Kz and lj cv and axles of the front axles are same as hilux ones...

Yes they are the same diameter and same splines but I think you will find that both sides are different lengths from the Hilux and the other ones I mentioned. The other difference is that on the later model ones the seal surface diameter is bigger, same as the 80 series.
Cheers
Tim

4wdstuff wrote:

Kz and lj cv and axles of the front axles are same as hilux ones...

Yes they are the same diameter and same splines but I think you will find that both sides are different lengths from the Hilux and the other ones I mentioned. The other difference is that on the later model ones the seal surface diameter is bigger, same as the 80 series.
Cheers
Tim

Yer rear diff is different but i had hilux axles and cv in my lj71 diff for awhile and the only difference is the cv cup is bigger on lj

i had hilux axles and cv in my lj71 diff for awhile and the only difference is the cv cup is bigger on lj

That is odd, don't want to start an argument, just want to make sure people have the correct information.

Have a look at these two discussions

http://www.offroadexpress.kiwi/Forums/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=31346
and
http://www.offroadexpress.kiwi/Forums/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=31422

Also to save any confusion I have 2 user names, suzolla and 4wdstuff
Cheers
Tim

Hmm unless i had a pre 90 diff then....

Cause i just got a bundera chassie and got told by linside and toyota that its same front diff as a hilux, hope so cause im about to get inner axle seals off you and that post says i need 80 series ones

I had a hilux with Holden V6, surf rear diff, Prado front. Went good on 35's. Did blow a front diff but that was completely my fault.

With the setup you are talking about I would say focus on keeping it lightish. The Prado diff would be a good choice as the internals are easily upgradeable (except the odd axle length as mentioned above) . Ideally get an 80 series diff as these have awesome cv's, but still stay lightish by using the (high pinion) 8 inch diff. Also they have a nice wide track (maybe to wide) Standard these have the stronger cv than hilux's (slightly larger bell on the cvs, otherwise effectively the same). Note that 40 series, 60 series, and hilux all share the same cv's and this will be your main weak point.

They standard rear surf diff should fairly easily deal with the 2.8 and 35's. Mine never gave any sign of trouble.

--
I priced The parts cost to build a standard LP 8" to reliably and capably handle (ie long term use) 35" tyres, locker potentially duals in the future. ie irrespective of engine...with enough multiplication the 2.8 will put massive amounts of useable torque to the ground.

Parts:
Longfield axles/birfields $1050 NZD
Longfield hub gear $110
Yukon 4.88/5.29 gears $400
Bearings/seals kit $275
Solid spacer $35
Replacement diff centre - ARB Locking Differential $1550
Donor axle ??? $NZD

= $3420NZD in parts without the donor axle. As a strength upgrade, Whether or not the replacement centre is needed (and just settle for a lockrite and new pin) is possiblly subject to debate. Then theres install, if the buyer cant install himself due to skills or fear of voiding warranties,another $2-$3000 NZD in labour?
So thats well over $5000NZD in addition to the donor axle cost.
Then theres the steering.

Whereas the FJ60 axle, the costs would be:
Longfield axles/birfields $1050 NZD
Longfield hub gear $110
Spartan locker $500 (new centre pin?)
Donor axle ??? $NZD

=$1660 NZD in parts without the donor axle but youre stuck with 4.11s. So you go to lower transfer gears/duals.

Then dare I say it, you consider a Nissan H233B steer axle. Strength wise, The OEM axles/gears/center of this unit are thought to be 'somewhere between' a Dana 44 and a Dana 60. Thats a big unit for a light vehicle.

Cheers all . The info off everyone is awesome well only 11 more days and she's getting parked up in my garage ready for surgery lol. Will post pics as we go along