Fitting a turbo to a Toyota 3L 2.8D

[KiwiBacon]

I do question whether a turbo causes extra heat.
I havn't seen any figures to prove it.
I run a dual air system on the hilux with supercharger.
All my driving is done on a pyrometer. The moment I turn the supercharger on, the exhaust temperature drops 150degrees celsius. This is the opposite of what everyone says should happen but because I have dual system know this for a fact.
I would like feedback on this.

Richard

I thought it was obvious that more boost = cooler exhaust. Maybe you're talking to the wrong people too often.
It's as simple as a heavier air charge heating less with the same amount of fuel in it.

Regarding turbos causing extra heat. If they're talking about the cooling system there is a point. If you increase your engine power by say 30%, then your radiator has to shed 30% more heat also. Some can't, especially if not well maintained.

[Slider878]

wow, i didnt think there was that much issues with the pump, i found this site -
http://4wheeling.ca/index.php?option=co ... 6&Itemid=2 and im trying to follow wat he has done, he says jus to turn the screw up on the pump... so u guys think this wont do? also he reckons he jus tapped into his alternator lines for oil feed and oil return. Is this ok to do? or is a braised tube in the sump better? I pretty much got all the parts to do this now, bar the water lines from the turbo! it didnt come with any! Do u guys know where i could get a hold of some? or could i have them made up? Wreckers dont even wanna know me...
cheers guys, without all this help id be still tryin to fit a ct12b to my lux lol

[tweake]

alternator lines work but the brazed connection to the sump would be better. that way the return off the turbo doesn't back up and cause poor oil flow through the turbo.

[Steve_t647]

The 2.8 diesel pump is a modified 2l pump (2.4) and as such was not good enough to use on the 2lt (without a boost compensator).

You can get away with this but you will not get the best life from the turbo or best life or output from the engine.
In a diesel more fuel means more heat and less fuel means more heat (turbo characteristics running lean you don't cool the internals with the liquid to gas conversion and compressed air is hotter) and the 2.8 pump works in a pretty narrow range the 3.0 diesel (5l) uses a different pump from the 2.8, if the 2.8 was that adjustable they would have used it for the extra 200ml volume of the 5l rather than modify the same design.

I ran a 5l pump in mine and the etg still got too hot and I needed to shut down on occasion (towing and hills) the change in a 2.8 to a 2.8 with a turbo puts it on par with some cars and it is no longer a chore to drive (it will never be a race car), but I would want to do it once and do it right as I have heard and seen damage done to a diesel motor from turbo's, as far as decompressing to allow for boost you can buy thicker headgaskets from Australia one thing I would recommend is the exhaust has to be changed completely to suit the turbo you need to get the heat away from the motor.

As to the fuel pump the options are the 5l (bolts up) or the 2.8 pump with a boost compensator fron the 2lt, the modified pump may be a better option with emission rules looking to be introduced (not sure if certification will require an emission pass) as I ran rich at idle and lean full noise the boost compensator fixes this, oh and as far as certification goes I am pertty sure I was just inside the improvement %age forcing me to get certification but the insurance company was informed.

Hope this helps you decide

As to the fuel pump the options are the 5l (bolts up) or the 2.8 pump with a boost compensator fron the 2lt, the modified pump may be a better option with emission rules looking to be introduced (not sure if certification will require an emission pass) as I ran rich at idle and lean full noise.

[KiwiBacon]

In a diesel more fuel means more heat and less fuel means more heat (turbo characteristics running lean you don't cool the internals with the liquid to gas conversion and compressed air is hotter)

Nope.
Less fuel means less heat. Otherwise we'd all be overheating at idle and at cruise. This is not a petrol engine, it cannot run "rich of stoich", it always runs lean.

There is no risk to your diesel engine or turbo through not getting enough fuel.

[Steve_t647]

Oops sorry was still thinking supercharged petrol for that one , Diesels can run lean and are quite happy running lean, you will not see all the performance benefits from it and the exhaust temps are usualy higher (complete burn in the cylinder means all the heat is thrown at the start of the exhaust headders and turbo exhaust housing) Getting this heat away is a good thing, running richer does this by fuel still being burned in the headers (liquid turning to gas pushes the air away from the head, in a Toyota diesel this is a good thing for long life.

[NJV6]

There is no risk through not getting enough fuel.

Reworded for ya... Yes there is, The risk is that it'll be soooo slow you'll be embaressed as a Honda City II passes ya!!

[KiwiBacon]

There is no risk through not getting enough fuel.

Reworded for ya... Yes there is, The risk is that it'll be soooo slow you'll be embaressed as a Honda City II passes ya!!

I've done that.
Turned the boost compensator screw the wrong way and went for a drive. There was a truck coming (500m away in a 50km/h zone) and I just got out the way in time.

[KiwiBacon]

Oops sorry was still thinking supercharged petrol for that one , Diesels can run lean and are quite happy running lean, you will not see all the performance benefits from it and the exhaust temps are usualy higher (complete burn in the cylinder means all the heat is thrown at the start of the exhaust headders and turbo exhaust housing) Getting this heat away is a good thing, running richer does this by fuel still being burned in the headers (liquid turning to gas pushes the air away from the head, in a Toyota diesel this is a good thing for long life.

Nope.
Less fuel always gives you cooler EGT's. The simple analogy of a smaller fire in the same size room is quite accurate.
Less power too but that's usually the idea as fuel quantity is how diesel engine speed and power output is controlled.

Less fuel burns sooner, it's not still happening in the manifold and it doesn't burn hotter.

[Slider878]

ahh i see, well it certainly sounds like the 2.8 pump wit the 2lt compensator is the way to go, i want my motor to go the distance, so will definately look into it! Is it easy enough to change it over yaself? i suppose i'll pay an arm and a leg for the pump tho. I started to turbo it the other night, got to the point of bolting on the 2lt-e manifold... didnt work, the holes dont line up. i could get all the bolts in the top (4) but could only get 2 in the bottom, so im now chasing a 2lt manifold... let me tell ya it aint easy gettin a hold of one! hope to find one this week, so i can finish it off!

[Bulletproof]

I think if you are going to the trouble abd effort of fitting a turbo to gain more power you need to do the job properly and fit an intercooler as well.
All motors get there power by expanding cold air and forcing the piston down.

To create boost creates alot of heat especially once over 5lbs. In my case I am putting 10 lbs into the intercooler and the heat generated at that pressure means you can't hold your hand on the outlet pipe from the supercharger because of its heat.
In the case of a turbo this is worse because the turbo itself is hot because of its position on the exhaust.

So with the air already fairly hot you are not going to get anything like the power you could achieve by cooling the air through an intercooler. So once fitted it is free power that would just be going to waste.

[KiwiBacon]

I think if you are going to the trouble abd effort of fitting a turbo to gain more power you need to do the job properly and fit an intercooler as well.
All motors get there power by expanding cold air and forcing the piston down.

To create boost creates alot of heat especially once over 5lbs. In my case I am putting 10 lbs into the intercooler and the heat generated at that pressure means you can't hold your hand on the outlet pipe from the supercharger because of its heat.
In the case of a turbo this is worse because the turbo itself is hot because of its position on the exhaust.

So with the air already fairly hot you are not going to get anything like the power you could achieve by cooling the air through an intercooler. So once fitted it is free power that would just be going to waste.

Superchargers put out hotter air because they use a compressor design that isn't as efficient. With a turbo there's very little heat transferred from the hot side to the cold side as the core joining the two is cooled by engine oil which is usually cooler than the out-going air.
But if you've got intake pipes running past exhaust pipes or manifolds, it'd be best to lag them.

At 15psi on a 20 deg day a good turbo puts out air at around 110C. At 10psi that's around 85 deg C which is about the point you'd consider adding an intercooler.
With a petrol engine an intercooler can be useful at even lower boost levels to prevent detonation, but on a diesel detonation isn't a concern so we're only worried about air density and below 10psi the pressure drop from the intercooler cancels out the extra density you get from cooling it.

At 20psi I'm feeding my engine air at around 135 deg C. Gotta get around to fitting that intercooler some-day.

[tweake]

intercooling increases the safty margin with your EGT's. basicly lower the inlet temps = lower EGT's which means you can add more fuel or just use it as a safty margin. just got to watch it as air-air incolling varies greatly with speed, so you still have to allow a fair bit with the fueling.

as contrast, my stock standard nissan runs peak 18psi with no intercooler. i'll have to check what the overboost cut off is, i think its around 30psi ! ! !

with the CT20 i would be spending the money on "highflowing" the turbo rather than intercooler. many people have reported lower temps due to this and also power increase. CT20 are a fairly lousy turbo, especially when you start trying to get it to flow a lot more air than standard (ie fit it to bigger motors).

[Slider878]

Hey guys, well just finished putting the ct20 turbo onto the lux, it was actually the dry Ct20 i used, because after bolting on the water cooled unit and running it for about 30 secs, it leaked oil and was blowing oil everywhere even out the exhaust fan and out the dump! so the seals in her must be well and truly shagged, so i stuffed around and got the dry unit on and all done! she works great! not sure if the 2 different ct20's have different power outputs? but hopefully after tomorrrow i'll be able to see how the lux really goes after the exhaust is all done as there is only the dump pipe with a small bit of pipe tacked onto the flange for me to get it to the exhaust shop! lol. I'm definately going to look into intercooling it tho! i took it for a small drive and it was runnin 7psi at at 100k's, is this ok for the turbo to be doin that psi on the highway? im pretty sure that was full boost too.
cheers

Scott

[crzyfl]

Can anyone report on a turboed 3L with an inter-cooler and results in terms of power and temps?

Also I spoke to a guy recently who said he had a prado manifold and turbo bolted up. Can anyone verify this? What would the performance and temps be like compared to the 2LT CT20 conversion?

[wellsie24]

you could always get forged turbo pistons for it instead of using a big head gasket the only downside of them is they are pretty expensive i am running a 3l with turbo off a 2.4d with turbo pistons fitted in my ln106 hilux and it is way better for towing/overtaking and going up hills good thing is its pretty straight foward to fitting a 2.4d turbo to a 3l motor

[tweake]

no real need.
standard compression is fine unless you really want to shove some big boost into that and you won't be using a ct20 to do that.
fitting turbo pistons sounds like a bit of BS to impress the young fella

a lot of factory turbo diesel engines run the exact same pistons and compression as their turbo version.

[wellsie24]

put boost guage on turbo today to see the amount of boost it was putting out turns out it runs at 14.5 psi moves pretty quick now

[Big Will]

is it intercooled yet?
What other mods have you made?

[shaun_d]

Is all this information at the start of this forum the same for a 5l. i want to turbo my 5l 3.0l diesel engine. will the surf turbo be big enough or can i use a 1kzte turbo with a surf manifold?? whats the best setup to use for a 5l? any help will be great thanks.

[Big Will]

Is all this information at the start of this forum the same for a 5l. i want to turbo my 5l 3.0l diesel engine. will the surf turbo be big enough or can i use a 1kzte turbo with a surf manifold?? whats the best setup to use for a 5l? any help will be great thanks.

Use a TD05 from an early mitsi EVO, they are plentiful, strong and able to supply plenty of air.