This should be a bit of humour for all you Toyota owners...
I have a Land Rover Discovery and keep on breaking diff heads. Now I have seen and read an article where they replace the LR diff centre with a Hilux one. Reasons are multiple, stronger, cheaper, more easily available, better choice of ratios.
My question is how much stronger? You guys with twin cam Supra motors, V6 or V8 conversions- do these diffs handle the power ok?
Are LSD Hilux diffs always 4 pinion?
Can you get open Hilux diffs but 4 pinion?
Hilux Diffs- How strong are they?
Hilux Diffs- How strong are they?
1992 Land Rover Discovery V8i, 5 speed, 12000lbs winch, Salisbury rear, 110 front, 65mm spring lift, dents in every panel, Rallywoods pinstriping.
-
Sadam_Husain
- Angry bird
- Posts: 5164
- Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2006 12:00 pm
- Location: WELLINGTON
Dare I say it cloggy - Go and do a search on outer limits in Oz, there are a number of them have done the toy centre conversion, or GQ fronts and Landcruiser rears (GQ rears fit to but have a centre diff)
There is heaps of info over there on it - then post your findings....
There is heaps of info over there on it - then post your findings....
SWB V6 Paj with one or two mods 
Re: Hilux Diffs- How strong are they?
Cloggy_NZ wrote:Are LSD Hilux diffs always 4 pinion?
Can you get open Hilux diffs but 4 pinion?
Hi, excuse a newbie....
Yup, if its LSD is 4 pinion, All diesel Hilux Surfs (and 4Runners) from 91ish on (when they went EFI) are 4 pinion diff, Open or LSD, over here pickups didn't get 4 pinion till a few years ago, so most are open 2 pinion.
Diff code last number 2, 4 or 5 means... 2 pinion, 4 pinion or LSD
4 pinion diffs have twice as many cooling fins on the diff housing compared to 2 pinion, so are easy to spot.
I've had a hot Rover 3.5 V8 and 35" Boggers either side of a 2 pinion diff for years, and it was fine.
Tony's got it right, the later 4 pinion jobs are the ones to get. My mate Klem blew a couple of 2 pinion ones, but they were between a supercharged lexus & 35" simexs.
GQ diffs would definitely be better, the CV's are massive compared with LR or hilux.
Cheers
Clint
GQ diffs would definitely be better, the CV's are massive compared with LR or hilux.
Cheers
Clint
UZJ71 Landcruiser
Jeep J20 - 1UZ-FE powered (part owner)
KTM 640
If it breaks, build it stronger.
If it doesn't break, drive it harder.
Jeep J20 - 1UZ-FE powered (part owner)
KTM 640
If it breaks, build it stronger.
If it doesn't break, drive it harder.
mudchuka wrote:not to mention, toyotas weak cvs, saw what happens to a cv in a surf witha 3.8 holden in it, bang.
go the mighty gq diffs front and rear and have no more problems.
The GQ's are also know to bust CV's you'd really want the GU
But why bother, stick with the Lux axles you get a huge range of gearing options from 5.71 to 3.9 with some common diff centres to the Hi-Ace van, which can be bought for $50
The big fat nissan diffs also have lower ground clearence, so a set of 33's on a lux offer the same as 35's on nissan.
The CV issues is sorted with an investment in longfields.
Hi
Ive been looking at doing the same thing to a range rover, I talked to Brian Howart from Howart engineering about some axles not bad prices he suggested using a (dont quote me ive got CRAFTS, can't rember a f**king thing) 109 cv joint, but I,ve talked to a guy running a range in the winch challange 35" simex and a 350hp tvr enging hes got some rings pressed on to his cv got them from maxi-drive good price under $100.00 each, said they work well.
Can you tell me what a longerfield is?
found this on a pirate 4x4 fourum about fitting hilux diffs.
"you can run the toy centers in the rover case. the rover diff and toy diff measure the same distance from center
of side gear to third member mounting face. so when put the toy diff in the rover case side gears are in the right spot
for the axle shafts. you have to drill new holes for the toy diff in the rover case, because the pattern is clocked the
new bolt pattern falls about in the center of the rover pattern.
some problems with this are the new pattern only allows for 8 of the 10 bolts two of them are to close to the openning
of the ring gear notch, so i ended up pluging these holes on the diff before install. i used a gasket for the toy diff
to make my pattern. then drilled the case and tapped the case instead of using studs. i have both left the old pattern
their and filled it in with welds."
Ive been looking at doing the same thing to a range rover, I talked to Brian Howart from Howart engineering about some axles not bad prices he suggested using a (dont quote me ive got CRAFTS, can't rember a f**king thing) 109 cv joint, but I,ve talked to a guy running a range in the winch challange 35" simex and a 350hp tvr enging hes got some rings pressed on to his cv got them from maxi-drive good price under $100.00 each, said they work well.
Can you tell me what a longerfield is?
found this on a pirate 4x4 fourum about fitting hilux diffs.
"you can run the toy centers in the rover case. the rover diff and toy diff measure the same distance from center
of side gear to third member mounting face. so when put the toy diff in the rover case side gears are in the right spot
for the axle shafts. you have to drill new holes for the toy diff in the rover case, because the pattern is clocked the
new bolt pattern falls about in the center of the rover pattern.
some problems with this are the new pattern only allows for 8 of the 10 bolts two of them are to close to the openning
of the ring gear notch, so i ended up pluging these holes on the diff before install. i used a gasket for the toy diff
to make my pattern. then drilled the case and tapped the case instead of using studs. i have both left the old pattern
their and filled it in with welds."
Longfields... Bobby Longs ( one Toyota God ) gift to Toyotas 
http://www.longfieldsuperaxles.com/
I've been running them in my lux for a couple of years, haven't hurt them yet and not afraid to punish em !
http://www.longfieldsuperaxles.com/
I've been running them in my lux for a couple of years, haven't hurt them yet and not afraid to punish em !
-
emknaps
- Driver/Navigator
- Posts: 34
- Joined: Mon May 09, 2005 12:00 pm
- Location: West Auckland
- Contact:
My 5 cents worth.
Toyota "G" series diffs.
these are in hilux's hiace's some prados some 4x4 liteaces and 70 series supras and the same era toyota sedans(IRS tho)
4.5 ratios are prone for breaking so stay clear of them,
Not all LSD's are 4 spider
the ones to find are the ones with extra ribs on the diff head. these help with pinion support and are also beafyer around the carrier bearings.
They are strong but will break under severe abuse/shock loading
LSD's will wear out but ive never seen one break.
a tightly shimed LSD is very nice to use.
nice on the road and more or less a locked diff once you push a bit of torgue thru it.
ALSO....
the pinion bearing spacer is a crush type tube which is crushed to give pre-load on the pinion bearings.
have your diff doctor replace this with a solid steel spacer of the correct measured length.
these original crush tubes tend to shorten in length under heavy use and then your pinion bearings have the wrong preload and then stuff starts to break as the pinion is no longer held still and in correct contact to the ring gear.
hmmm thats more like a $1.50's worth.
And yes i did break my 4.3 heavy cased LSD.
but this was under full throttle with the launch control feature on my aftermarket ecu in operation on a 5.4L injected chev.
sticky mud tyres on the road. i still have no idea why you'd need launch control on a 4X4.
Daniel.
Toyota "G" series diffs.
these are in hilux's hiace's some prados some 4x4 liteaces and 70 series supras and the same era toyota sedans(IRS tho)
4.5 ratios are prone for breaking so stay clear of them,
Not all LSD's are 4 spider
the ones to find are the ones with extra ribs on the diff head. these help with pinion support and are also beafyer around the carrier bearings.
They are strong but will break under severe abuse/shock loading
LSD's will wear out but ive never seen one break.
a tightly shimed LSD is very nice to use.
nice on the road and more or less a locked diff once you push a bit of torgue thru it.
ALSO....
the pinion bearing spacer is a crush type tube which is crushed to give pre-load on the pinion bearings.
have your diff doctor replace this with a solid steel spacer of the correct measured length.
these original crush tubes tend to shorten in length under heavy use and then your pinion bearings have the wrong preload and then stuff starts to break as the pinion is no longer held still and in correct contact to the ring gear.
hmmm thats more like a $1.50's worth.
And yes i did break my 4.3 heavy cased LSD.
but this was under full throttle with the launch control feature on my aftermarket ecu in operation on a 5.4L injected chev.
sticky mud tyres on the road. i still have no idea why you'd need launch control on a 4X4.
Daniel.
emknaps wrote:My 5 cents worth.
4.5 ratios are prone for breaking so stay clear of them,
Daniel.
Are they?
I run 4.5s in my 3.5 V8 lux and have had no trouble, but also run a old 3Y in my other lux and have gone thru numerous 4.88s? (stripped the crownwheels) A thread a little while ago discussed the theory that the lower the ratio gears the less pinion to crown wheel contact which made them weaker, and I'll still go along with that.
-
emknaps
- Driver/Navigator
- Posts: 34
- Joined: Mon May 09, 2005 12:00 pm
- Location: West Auckland
- Contact:
I guess the pinion contact thoery could have some truth behind it.
My diff doctor has agreed with me that 4.5's seam to be more prone to ring,pinion failure than most, and my self i have seen a few 4.5's mashed up in various vehicles
i found some interesting info on here:
http://home.4x4wire.com/erik/diffs/
this is a USA site so some info will vary to here as we have so many JDM spec'd trucks.
it has a link to a ratio chart aswell, very usefull.
Daniel.
My diff doctor has agreed with me that 4.5's seam to be more prone to ring,pinion failure than most, and my self i have seen a few 4.5's mashed up in various vehicles
i found some interesting info on here:
http://home.4x4wire.com/erik/diffs/
this is a USA site so some info will vary to here as we have so many JDM spec'd trucks.
it has a link to a ratio chart aswell, very usefull.
Daniel.
Thanks a lot guys, certainly some food for thought here and on the Outer Limits 4x4 site.
I am currently waiting to hear back from a US supplier of aftermarket 4 pinion LR carriers. This together with some Howat axles sound like it might be the cheapest, strongest and easiest option.
Went and saw Brian Howat for advice and to get a spare diff head of him to replace my busted one. Turn out he runs Hilux diffs in his Range Rover and whilst they do the trick he reckons he would not do another one for a paying customer as this stage. From what I understood he felt the size and strengtht of the bearings and bearing caps left a little to be desired and actually made new caps and fitted larger than stock carrier bearings to be on the safe side. Maybe this is overkill after reading on here about some guys running SB Chevy's in their Luxes without any problems.
If I can get the strength required without doing any engineering work like boring out hubs, re studding axle housing etc. and at a reasonable cost plus the fact I can do one diff at a time (a Hilux conversion means doing both front and rear at the same time) then retaining the LR diff head, standard driveshafts etc and just fitted a near bullet proof carrier and bullet proof axles looks like the better option at this stage.
I am currently waiting to hear back from a US supplier of aftermarket 4 pinion LR carriers. This together with some Howat axles sound like it might be the cheapest, strongest and easiest option.
Went and saw Brian Howat for advice and to get a spare diff head of him to replace my busted one. Turn out he runs Hilux diffs in his Range Rover and whilst they do the trick he reckons he would not do another one for a paying customer as this stage. From what I understood he felt the size and strengtht of the bearings and bearing caps left a little to be desired and actually made new caps and fitted larger than stock carrier bearings to be on the safe side. Maybe this is overkill after reading on here about some guys running SB Chevy's in their Luxes without any problems.
If I can get the strength required without doing any engineering work like boring out hubs, re studding axle housing etc. and at a reasonable cost plus the fact I can do one diff at a time (a Hilux conversion means doing both front and rear at the same time) then retaining the LR diff head, standard driveshafts etc and just fitted a near bullet proof carrier and bullet proof axles looks like the better option at this stage.
1992 Land Rover Discovery V8i, 5 speed, 12000lbs winch, Salisbury rear, 110 front, 65mm spring lift, dents in every panel, Rallywoods pinstriping.
JAMUBA wrote:Hi Cloggy
So dose Howat engineering make stronger axles to fit a standard rover diff? Can you give me some info no those 4 spider diffs. what will you do about your cv's?
Cheers
Chris J
He sure does, makes some of the best axles money can buy and they don't cost the earth. He will make whatever you want but as an example some axles guaranteed not to break to fit the rover diff will cost about $150 each. To this cost you will need to add the cost of 110 drive flanges at about $80.00 each.
http://www.greatbasinrovers.com/diffs.html#gbr4pindiffcarrier is the link to the 4 spider diffs I am talking about.
Front CV's are easy, just fit some 110 ones.
1992 Land Rover Discovery V8i, 5 speed, 12000lbs winch, Salisbury rear, 110 front, 65mm spring lift, dents in every panel, Rallywoods pinstriping.