batteries

[taranaki surf]

Hey guys sorting out the little things first and top of the list at the mo is batteries the ones in my surf are the ones i bought it with and are starting to get tired. since i am planning to mount a winch next time funds allow i was wondering whats the minimum size batteries i should buy cheers

[kbushnz]

Most winch makers recommend 650 cca or more...

[keithal]

personally id go for the biggest one you can fit in the space youve got

[taranaki surf]

So since i have twin batteries 2 500-550cca should sufice dose it double cca having 2 in there im realy not electricaly minded

[Crash bandicoot]

i recently picked up two heavy commercial 770cca exides for the mistral from the ware house when they had a sale on got them for 189 each usual retail was 279.

[mudlva]

minimum of 2 x 650cca's or bigger if you can afford it

as stated above the bigger the better, your winch will love you for it, and so will the alternator

[ChurchurDan]

Before you buy batteries you should know there are 2 types of automotive batteries. Calcium and Lead antinomy.
All maintenance free batteries are calcium. A calcium battery is designed to start your engine not to supply power for accessories and they do not cycle well. If you discharge and recharge them you will severly shorten there life.
Nearly all automotive batteries are calcium.
A lead antinomy battery is capable of shallow cycling without doing damage to it.
Some suppliers still do Lead antimony batteries in NS70 and N70 sizes which is what we need for our 4x4s. If you are planning on doing a bit of winching get some LA batteries not calcium's. If you want to do a lot of winching get some deep cycle or optima style batteries.
The 650cca reccomendation is for 1 battery application's. If you have 2 batteries you can go for 2 smaller batteries. The NS70la's we sell at work are rated at 550cca so 2 in parallel would give you 1100cca which is what I would fit into a surf.

[taranaki surf]

Thanks mate exatly what i needed to know cheers

[T-mo]

+1 for NS70's, (650CCA) Great batteries. I personally don't like the MF versions (Maintenance free) mainly due to the fact you cannot test or top up the electrolyte, apparently they don't like rocking around as much as the non MF ones too.

Be aware of battery terminal positions too. Most Surf's I've worked on require a NS70 and a NS70L (The L indicates the negative terminal is on the left of the battery, a NS70 has a negative terminal on the right)

Depending on your location price will vary. Try hitting the actual disturbers (The Century/Exide warehouse rather than an auto sparky) and seeing if they will sell direct to you. I got my new Century ones at trade price. 2x NS70MF's for $320.00 inc GST.

PS: Supercharge batteries are c**p..

[T-mo]

So since i have twin batteries 2 500-550cca should sufice dose it double cca having 2 in there im realy not electricaly minded

In basic terms yes. However, the CCA rating of a battery is the measure of its maximum current draw for 30 seconds at 0 degrees F ambient temperature before it is too depleted to start an engine. Be aware marine batteries are measured differently and shouldn't be used in cars/4x4s.

The rating that will help you the most is the Ah (Ampere-hours) rating, which will tell you how many amps your battery will supply at a constant rate for an hour before its dead. eg. 100 Ah battery will provide 100amps for one hour, 200 amps for 30 minutes etc.

When two batteries are run in parallel the voltage stays constant and the Ah rating are added. So if your batteries are the same it doubles. Ah ratings are measured without the battery being connected to a charging source so your alternator will charge them as they drain so they will run longer.

However, winches draw A LOT of current under load and I'm unaware of a battery/alternator combination that will not drain your batteries completely after slightly prolonged use. You can get alternators rewound that will output more amps which charges a battery faster but your winch will still win in the end. Also running a smaller gauge wire (larger diameter, gauge is backwards (thank the Americans..)), will lower your voltage drop across the cable and lower its impedance but it doesn't make a giant difference.

Any other questions PM me, my trade training taught me a reasonable about about batteries and I've help numerous mates out with battery/charging issues.

[tweake]

another battery that fits the surf is the N70ZZL or N70ZZ (i think thats the one, will double check later.) 720cca, its same height and width as stock battery but longer. fits passenger side with removal of air duct.

[skid]

+1 for NS70's, (650CCA) Great batteries. I personally don't like the MF versions (Maintenance free) mainly due to the fact you cannot test or top up the electrolyte, apparently they don't like rocking around as much as the non MF ones too.

beg to differ, personally seen a MF battery fall out of a 4wd and roll 50m back down a very steep rocky track, once it was retrieved it was bolted back in and the vehicle fired straight up with no issues

PS: Supercharge batteries are c**p..

and why do you say this, I fond them to be cheaper than some of the more commonly known brands and the CCA ratings on them are far superior to other brands as well

[Trundle]

PS: Supercharge batteries are c**p..

and why do you say this, I fond them to be cheaper than some of the more commonly known brands and the CCA ratings on them are far superior to other brands as well

[/quote][/quote]

I contracted to the aa and state insurance for almost a decade ,
Super charge batteries are the biggest piles of shit ever , end of storey ,
I lost count of the amount of near new super charge batteries that were faulty and by the way they handed them out under warantee without even confirming by load testing them , they new it to !!!

[T-mo]

+1 for NS70's, (650CCA) Great batteries. I personally don't like the MF versions (Maintenance free) mainly due to the fact you cannot test or top up the electrolyte, apparently they don't like rocking around as much as the non MF ones too.

beg to differ, personally seen a MF battery fall out of a 4wd and roll 50m back down a very steep rocky track, once it was retrieved it was bolted back in and the vehicle fired straight up with no issues

PS: Supercharge batteries are c**p..

and why do you say this, I fond them to be cheaper than some of the more commonly known brands and the CCA ratings on them are far superior to other brands as well

Everyone has their own opinion about things, hence, I said I PERSONALLY don't like MF batteries. I honestly think being able to top up and test your battery is essential, especially as it ages. I've never had them but was warned away from them from multiple people, including the people who sell them when I got new ones last year.

I've had nothing but bad experiences with Supercharge and other cheaper generic battery brands. MY friend worked for a battery distributor and told me a few horror stories about them. I guess you get what you pay for (most of the time) and remember a poor man will pay twice.

[Suza]

Deal direct with the suppliers, they will all sell to the public and often at cheaper prices.

[ladeda]

MF bats or calcium calcium bats are more rugged than lead antimony bats that's one of the reasons they were invented to withstand the harsh environment that a bat lives in. The calcium/lead plate are harder and stronger than antimony/lead plates. One of the down sides is the calcium plates sulphate much faster when voltage is dropped down and is also harder to de-sulphate the longer it's left in a discharged state. That's why MF bats have a special charger that pulses the batt amongst other things to break down the resistance. If this is not done the bat will never perform properly and will have a much shorter shelf life. On the plus side MF bats will (if looked after properly) last much longer than antimony bats. They will also by nature hold a higher cranking ability for longer than an antimony bat= smaller in size bigger in balls
I have a 800cca calcium bat that has had many many thrashings by the winch ( I mean come on I drive a lada of corse the winch gets a lot of use ) I've charged it after every outing and it still test perfect after 2 years.

[ChurchurDan]

The calcium was added to the positive plates (the negative plates have had it since the 50's) to make the battery maintenance free, with calcium in both plates the water usage was eliminated. Also it increased battery voltage from 12.5 volts to 12.6 volts which also allowed for higher charge voltage which is what the automotive manufactures wanted. These 2 changes were wanted buy car makers not battery manufactures.
This all happened in the early 2000's and all suppliers went calcium calcium for battery construction and it caused all sorts off problems with NZ's old vehicle fleet that were not designed to have a calcium battery.
Nearly all vehicles made before about 2005 do not charge a calcium battery properly and have short battery life because of it. Approx 2-4 years for calcium an LA battery in the same application will get approx 4-6 years.


Also calcium in the plates makes them more fragile with less resilience to vibration and cycling. I work for a Battery Town Auto Electrical business and we recently started supplying batteries to Fontera for the tankers. Some of them do a lot of millage on shingle roads and were only getting 3 months out of a set of calcium batteries. With LA batteries we now get 9-12 months in the same trucks.

Personally I think calcium batteries have there place but not in an older 4WD with a winch, especially if it cant charge at 14.4 - 14.6 volts.

[ladeda]

Calcium has been used in automotive bats for over a hundred years. Calcium calcium bats hold a full charge for allot longer and can withstand a higher parasitic load, like all modern vehicles have now, for allot longer than older bats, hey also have a much longer shelf life due to a much lower self drain rate as antimony bats, Calcium has advantages over antimony of generally 80% less off gassing depending on the amount of calcium added, Most bat plates will still have some small amount of antimony present around 1% down from around %7 depending on make, It also makes the lead plates stronger in their structure. Most manufactures have overcome the low charging problem of older vehicles by adding tin, so older vehicles can use calcium bats if the correct one if applied, IMO proper application and care, modern calcium calcium bats will last longer than a hybrid or straight antimony. I have personally witnessed a CC bat last 8 years and that was in a mid 90's pulsar. but as the story goes every battery is different.